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of chimneys in towns and country districts in the vicinity of towns similar to the Bill
LEEDS BANKRUPTCY COURT. passed in 1853 for the Metropolis ?
QUESTION. SiR GEORGE GREY replied, that the Act which applied to the metropolis had General, Whether any steps have been
MR. HOWES asked the Attorney had a most beneficial effect, and it was taken to prosecute the Reverend George desirable to extend it to the whole country: Rogers Harding, Patrick Robert Welch, No Bill had been at present prepared with and the Hon. Richard Bethell, or any of that object, but he felt the importance of them, for corrupt practices in obtaining, or the subject. He hoped it might be pos- attempting to obtain, a judicial appointment, sible to extend the provisions of that Act.
as suggested by the Report of the Select
Committee on the Leeds Bankruptcy Court; CATTLE DISEASES BILL.-QUESTION. and, if no such steps have yet been taken,
MR. TOLLEMACHE asked the Secre- / what is the cause of the delay? tary of State for the Home Department,
THE ATTORNEY GENERAL said, Whether, when the House is in Com- that in accordance with the recommendamittee on the Cattle Diseases Bill, he will tion of the Select Committee appointed by consent to separate the compensation the last Parliament, and with the engageclauses from the other portions of the Bill, ment which the Government gave at that and to embody such clauses in a separate time, criminal informations were filed last Bill ? Cheshire would be greatly affected Michaelmas Term against Mr. Welch and by the compensation clauses ; but he had the Hon. Richard Bethell, and they now had no opportunity of consulting with any stood on the list for trial at the present persons connected with that county re- sittings ; and as far as the Crown was specting those clauses, as he had not yet concerned, they were ready to proceed to received a copy of the Bill.
trial. As to the Rev. Mr. Harding, I Sın GEORGE GREY said, it would be think that the hon. Gentleman will feel impossible for him to accede to such a that if the Crown had prosecuted him it request. The payment of compensation would have thrown delay and difficulty in for animals slaughtered, by order of the the way of a proper investigation of the local authorities, and the power to cause matter ; because Mr. Harding will be a such animals to be slaughtered, were essen
most necessary witness, and it would intially connected. The power to slaughter deed be impossible to proceed with the could not be given without a power to prosecution without his evidence. award compensation. At all events, he thought it would be better to postpone, to
JAMAICA.- QUESTION. a future occasion, any consideration of the
SIR JOHN PAKINGTON asked the question of separating the Bill into two Secretary of State for the Colonies, Whether parts. MR. SCLATER-BOOTH thought it
he intends to bring on his measure for the would be more convenient to leave ali Government of Jamaica on Thursday next? details as to the mode of raising the money Bill nor any other business ought to impede
He suggested that neither the Jamaica for compensation, in order that they might the progress of the Cattle Diseases Bill, and be dealt with in a separate Bill. MR. TOLLEMACHE asked, if he was
he trusted the Government would proceed to understand that the right hon. Gentle with that Bill de die in diem.
MR. CARDWELL said, he was entirely man definitively declined to accede to the
in the hands of the House in regard to request which he had just made ?
SIR GEORGE GREY repeated that he that early provision should be made for the thought it would be impossible to sepa- Government of the colony ; but the Cattle rate those two provisions of the Bill.
Diseases Bill would have the precedence of
other business on Thursday, and if the Bill ASH WEDNESDAY-ADJOURNMENT
relating to Jamaica should be called on at OF THE HOUSE.
so late an hour that the House would be On the Motion of Mr. CHANCELLOR of unwilling to hear his statement, he should the EXCHEQUER, it was ordered, • That not of course press it. He was, however, the House at its rising do adjourn till to- anxious that the Government of the colony morrow at Two of the clock "--(the morrow should receive early legislation in that being Ash Wednesday.)
House. VOL, CLXXXI. (THIRD SERIES. ]
expressing his regret that the Government COMMITTEE OF COUNCIL ON
had not, on the first night of the Session, EDUCATION,
laid a Bill on this subject on the table of the SELECT COMMITTEE APPOINTED. House. The committee which was convened SIR JOHN PAKINGTON, in moving by the Lord Lieutenant agreed to certain that a Select Committee be appointed to in specific resolutions, which proposed to deal quire into the constitution of the Committee with this disease, should it arise, in that of Council on Education, &c., said, that country in a manner different from the the Motion was, in fact, for the renewal of mode in which it had been dealt with in a Committee which sat during the whole of this country. The Irish Government had last Session, and which was engaged in the adopted those recommendations, in so far as investigation of the two Questions stated. it was in its power to do so, by Order in The scope of the inquiry proved to be so Council. They had agreed that, in case extended, and the evidence so voluminous, an outbreak of the disease took place, the that the Committee were unable to conclude best thing to do would be to draw a cordon their labours and present their Report ; at once around the infected district, to and, under these circumstances, he con- adopt the most stringent measures against tented himself by merely moving for the the ingress and the egress of cattle, and re-appointment of the Committee. to enforce the compulsory slaughter of in
fected cattle. But here a difficulty arose, Motion agreed to.
for the committee recommended that the Select Committee appointed, “ to inquire into compulsory slaughter of cattle should be the constitution of the Committee of Council on accompanied by compensation up to twoEducation, and the system under which the busi- thirds of the value of the animals destroyed. ness of the office is conducted; and also into the In this country he believed that one of the best mode of extending the benefits of Government Inspection and the Parliamentary Grant to greatest misfortunes incidental to the schools at present unassisted by the State.” –(Sir cattle plague had been the unfortunate John Pakington.)
Order in Council which gave powers of And on February 20 Select Committee compulsory slaughter without offering comnominated as follows:
pensation. The system suggested by the
committee which had now been for some Sir John PAKINGTON, Mr. BRUCE,Viscount CRANBOURNE, Mr. Buxton, Mr. Howes, Mr. Clay, Mr. weeks before the country, and had reADDERLEY, Mr. Henry Cowper, Sir STAFFORD ceived very general approbation on all NORTHOOTE, Sir COLMAN O'Logulen, Mr. Wal hands, would really be inoperative and POLE, Mr. Shaw LeFevre, Mr. LIDDELL, Mrcome to nothing unless it were supMORRISON, and Mr. STIRLING :-Power to send for persons, papers, and records ; Five to be the
plemented by sufficient compensation for quorum.
slaughtered animals. Though, happily,
the measures which had been taken had CATTLE PLAGUE (IRELAND).
been, under Providence, the means of
diverting this terrible disaster from the MOTION FOR PAPERS,
shores of Ireland, yet the country ran LORD NAAS, in rising to move for "Copy daily risk of an outbreak of the disease. It of the Report of the Committee convened was liable to happen at any moment, and if by the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland to con- such an outbreak should occur, the Govern. sider the measures that might be adopted for ment were without the power to carry out arresting the progress of the Cattle Plague, the measures which all in Ireland adnitted in case of its appearance in Ireland,” to be necessary. Not a moment was to be and to ask when the Bill promised by the lost in introducing and passivg a Bill, and Secretary of State will be laid upon the he believed that Government would find table, said, he hoped the great importance very little difficulty in the matter. A quesof the matter would excuse the few remarks tion might, perhaps, arise as to the mode in he proposed to address to the House. which the compensation was to be levied, Ireland was now placed in presence of one but that would be easily settled. Ho of the greatest dangers that ever menaced hoped that, before another day elapsed, a country. The destructive effects of the they might have an opportunity of seecattle plague in England had been very ing the measure of the Government, and great; but if, unfortunately, the plague that, if possible, it would be made law should extend to Ireland, the misfortune within a week. He must, however, warn would be fifty times as disastrous to that the Government that they would make country. He could not help, therefore, a mistake if they intrusted the enforcement of their measures to local authorities, the purposes of the Bill. There were now who could not carry out the system re- two distinct oaths taken by Members of commended by the committee. It must be the House ; one by Protestants and the carried out by Government officers alone, other by Roman Catholics. The Protesand its operations must be uniform through- tant oath was framed in 1858, when an out the country. No board of guardians, Act was passed consolidating the three or magistrates in petty or quarter sessions, oaths, which, previous to that period, were or committee of a grand jury, could carry taken separately, of allegiance, abjuration, out the system recommended with any and supremacy. With regard to the part chance or hope of success. He hoped, of the oath which relates to allegiance to therefore, that a Bill embodying the re- the Crown, which was common to both commendations of the committee would be Protestants and Roman Catholics, no one introduced immediately by the Government, could refuse for å moment to admit that it and that the Government would take on
was a very proper oath to be taken by themselves the responsibility of carrying every Member of the House. He did not out all its provisions.
think there was a Member of the House SIR GEORGE GREY said, that there who would not take that oath willingly. was no objection to the production of the But, with reference to the second part of Report. The Government had been in the oath taken alike by Protestants and communication with the Lord Lieutenant Roman Catholics—the oath of abjuration on the subject of the measures that it was -he thought they would all agree that the desirable should be adopted in the event of time had come when it could and ought to the cattle plague appearing in Ireland, and be dispensed with. It was first required the Attorney General and the Solicitor to be taken in the reign of William III., General had been instructed to draw up a on the death of James II., and the asBill founded on the report of the committee sumption by the son of James II. of the and on the views of the Lord Lieutenant. title of King of England, when in fact a It was, however, quite necessary that the real danger menaced the Throne of this Bill should be seen by Lord Wodehouse kingdom. Rather, however, than give his and the Irish Government, and he could own opinion of this part of the oath, he not therefore fix the day when it would be would quote the words of a most eminent brought in; but it would be introduced on authority-Lord Lyndhurst - and which an early day. There was this difference were spoken in 1858. He said — between Ireland and this country, that in “ The object of this oath had long ceased. The Ireland there was an army of police directly descendants of the Pretender had long been responsible to the central Government and extinct. What, then, was the course which every not to the local authoritiee, and therefore man of common sense would consider ought, un. that could be done in Ireland which there to repeal the oath framed for a particular pur
der those circumstances, to be pursued ? Simply was no means of doing here.
pose, and the utility of which was now at an Motion agreed to: Return ordered.
The latter part of the oath taken by ProPARLIAMENTARY OATHS BILL. testants, embodying the negative part of RESOLUTION IN COMMITTEE. BILL READ
the oath of supremacy in which the juris
diction of the Pope, or of any other foreign THE FIRST TIME.
prince in this country is denied, appeared Acts read ;-considered in Committee.
to him to be entirely useless. He could (In the Committee.)
not see the necessity of any Protestant SIR GEORGE GREY said, that the Member of the House being called upon subject he was about to introduce was one for a declaration that the Pope had no which, like several others that had been spiritual or ecclesiastical jurisdiction in this adverted to that evening, had been fre- country. It was really an absurdity in quently brought under the notice of the the case of Protestant Members, vone of House. A considerable discussion had taken whom can be suspected of holding such an place on it only so recently as last Session. opinion. As it respects, therefore, a ProHe did not propose, therefore, to trouble testant Member, the oath of allegiance the House at any length, but should re- seems to be quite sufficient. As to the serve a fuller statement of the objects of oath taken by Roman Catholics, the same the Bill for the second reading, provided reasons which he liad given in the case of as lie hoped that the House allowed him the Protestanis, as to that part of it which to bring it in. But he would state shortly required the abjuration of the Pretender, applied equally to them. There were other tially the oath of allegiance to the Crown. portions of the Roman Catholic oath framed The Members professing the Jewish reliin 1829 as a security against any danger gion sat now in that House not by abarising from the admission of Roman Ca- solute right but by sufferance, the result of tholics to Parliament, which formed the a compromise adopted to terminate a long subject of a great deal of discussion last struggle, but it was impossible not to see Session-into
these he did not wish now to that that arrangement must be temporary. enter or to invite debate. He concurred Those Gentlemen had sat there for some at that time with the right bon. Member years, and it would be absurd to ask for the county of Limerick (Mr. Monsell), if any danger had arisen to the Crown, who introduced a Bill on that subject, that the Church, or the Constitution, from portions of the oath were needlessly offen- Jews sitting in that House. They had sive to Roman Catholics, and that there was taken part, with credit to themselves, in not the slightest use in retaining them, the discussions in the House, and had and that other parts were ambiguous, performed their duty with integrity and and open to doubtful and complicating ability. He (Sir George Grey) thought construction ; and, therefore, he supported the time was come when the Members prothe proposal made by his right hon. Friend fessing the Jewish religion should be adlast Session for their omission from the mitted to all the privileges which were oath. The hon. and learned Member enjoyed by the Members of other religious for Belfast (Sir Hugh Cairns) acquiesced denominations. By the adoption of the in those omissions, so far as they embraced nieasure he proposed Members would be rethose words which were obviously offen- lieved from the necessity, on coming to the sive. I do not, therefore, anticipate any dif- table after a general election, of ranging ference of opinion as to them. Other parts themselves in three divisions when taking of the oath related to the settlement of the oaths. Let no man be asked any quesproperty and the maintenance of the Es- tion as to bis religion, but let him take tablished Church, and of the Protestant his sent in the House if qualified to sit religion. With regard to these he had there, in the opinion of those who sent only to say that in his opinion no real | him there, on taking the oath of allegiance security for the Established Church or the as a loyal subject of the Crown. The Bill Protestant religion was given by their re- which he proposed to introduce would be a tention, and he thought that we ought not, short one, repealing the present oaths, and needlessly, to place our Roman Catholic providing that the oath to be taken shall fellow subjects, as Members of the Le be as follows :gislature, on a footing different from that we “I A. B., do swear that I will bear faithful ourselves occupy. As to the denial of and true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Victhe jurisdiction or authority of any foreign toria, and defend her to the utmost of my power prince or prelate, Roman Catholice were, that shall be made against her crown, power, and
against all attempts and conspiracies whatever for obvious reasons, exempted from the
dignity.” denial of spiritual authority, and while it the right hon. Baronet concluded by seemed absurd to require this denial only movingfrom those who have no concern in it, the
“ That the Chairman be directed to move the pecessity for denying civil or temporal House, that leave be given to bring in a Bill authority is obviated by the oath of alle- to amend the law relating to Parliamentary giance, and he (Sir George Grey) was not oaths." aware that any Roman Catholic would hold MR. NEWDEGATE said, that consi. that the Pope exercised any civil or tem- dering the nature of the Bill which the poral jurisdiction within this country. In right hon. Baronet had proposed, the tone fact, the person who would assert this of his speech was singularly smooth. He would fail in his allegiance, and might seemed to treat his proposal as though bring himself within the penalties of trea- it dealt with matters of but slight importson. The opinion which he (Sir George ance-matters almost of indifference. No Grey) had expressed last Session was very one who heard the right hon. Gentleman generally concurred in-namely, that there could, from his tone or his manner, have should be one uniform oath for all. If believed that he was proposing the disturbthere was one general oath, they might ance of a great constitutional settlement. limit it to the first part of the oath taken He (Mr. Newdegate) did not intend to take without hesitation both by Protestants and the sense of the House at present on the Roman Catholics, which would be substan- subject matter of the intended Bill, though
Sir George Grey
divisions had often been taken at the out-sought to deprive the Protestant subjects set of proposals, which, as in the present of Her Majesty of the advantage enjoyed case, would destroy a settlement that had and the security conferred by the public been adopted, after a controversy upon this recognition of the fact that the Sovereign subject which had lasted eleven years. It must be a Protestant ? Then the right was eight years since the Oaths Consolida- hon. Gentleman proceeded to the oath of tion Act was passed, and Parliament was supremacy, and proposed to sweep away now asked, after so short an interval, to the negative portions of it. Perhaps disturb the settlement then made with hon. Gentlemen
of respect to Parliamentary oaths. He held what was contained in those negative in his hand a pamphlet which had been portions. The man who took the oath circulated among the Members of the condemned and rejected the pretensions of House. It was entitied Brief Sugges- any foreign Power whatsoever, by whomtions as to the Oaths taken by Members soever pretended rightfully to exercise any of Parliament and Others-Her Majesty's authority, ecclesiastical or temporal, spiritSubjects. The tone of the pamphlet was ual or civil, within these realms. That similar to that adopted by the right hon. was no slight security to abandon. The Gentleman the Secretary of State for the concession of the right hon. Gentleman Home Department. The substance was was no slight concession to propose. He much the same as that of the right hon. would not detain the House by going into Baronet's speech. There was no author's the provisions of the Roman Catholic oath name appended to the pamphlet, and it which it was proposed to repeal, since that was printed for private circulation. He subject had been not long since debated. (Mr. 'Newdegate) almost came to the con- Let it suffice to remind the House that it clusion that it emanated from the right hon. contained declarations to be made on the Gentleman. If the pamphlet did not ema- part of Roman Catholics that they would pate from the right hon. Gentleman, per- not use the power or privileges to which haps he had picked out such portions as they might become entitled by virtue of the he thought might be used in inducing functions or offices to which they were adMembers of the House to accede to his mitted for the disturbance of the rights of proposal. He (Mr. Newdegate) would ask property or the rights of the Church of the attention of the House to the few England within these realms. He would observations he was about to offer on the ask whether, at the present time, when subject of the Oaths Bill. It was quite the Fenian conspiracy was at work in true that the primary object of the oath Ireland, when they all rejoiced to see taken by Members was to obtain from them many Roman Catholics proving by their a declaration of allegiance. No one had as conduct that they abide by the declarayet been bold enough to propose the tion contained in their oath that they abolition of the oath of allegiance. The will not sanction the disturbance of the allegiance of Englishmen, however, was settlement of property-he would ask not simply the allegiance of subjects to whether this was a fitting and appropriate an absolute Sovereign, but the allegiance opportunity for absolving them from this of citizens to a Sovereign who was bound public recognition of the sanctity of proby certain conditions as to the adminis- perty? Hon. Members should remember tration and exercise of her power. The that their oaths included and recognized, right hon. Gentleman asked, “Why not not merely the sovereignty of the Queen, sweep away the oath of abjuration, now but the rights of the subject, the sanctity that the Pretender and his lineal de- of property, and the rights and priviscendants are no more?” But the right leges of the Established Church. If there hon. Gentleman took care never to touch were Members of that House who would upon the fact that that oath limits the disturb these sacred portions of our law succession to the Crown to the descend. and constitution, were they men in whose ants of the Princess Sophie of Hanover, favour the House would abrogate the being Protestants. Now, one condition of provisions of those oaths which had been our allegiance is that the Sovereign shall taken willingly, cordially, and ex animo be a Protestant. He might be told by every Member of that House within that that great advantage is secured by the last ten days, and for so many years the Act of Settlement. But if it was past? He might ask whether the attithought necessary still to retain the de- iude of the Papacy and its agents in this claration of allegiance, why was it now country at present was such as would