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common cause with the South, and resist to the power of the sword. No such madness was erer last extremity. A heresy in this Convention advocated. I cannot believe that a man would then, is the proposition or a declaration that if for one moment advocate the marching of an coercion is attempted, we will not aid; and this army upon the North or the South, when such an is said to be an insult to the Northern States. It attempt would dissolve this Union beyond the is said, if it is passed, the Northern States will power of reconstruction. As a distinguished son be offended, and that no compromise can be of Illinois has said: "When an army is marched made. Are we acting with the Border States ? into these States, and when blood is shed, the sun Are we taking the bold position that they are of American liberty will set forever behind a sea sueing for compromise? If we vote down the of blood, and will rise no more." resolution, we say by voting it down, (taking the If the Convention will indulge me one moment language that has been used upon this floor-the I will read one sentence upon this very subject, substance of it,) that we will furnish men and from the Governor of Virginia, and I desire to money. There are two sides to this question. read it in connection with what I have said.One is that we will not furnish men and Speaking in reference to the propositions from money; but, if we vote this resolution down, New York and Ohio, he said: we say that we will

furnish

and “This I understand to be a declaration of their money, and are ready so to do. Without under- readiness and willingness to sacrifice the men and taking at present to determine, gentlemen of the money of that State, in the effort to coerce the Convention, whether the General Government slaveholding States to submission to Federal auhas the right to coerce the Southern States, under thority. The Governor and Legislature of New the Constitution, a question that I intend yet to York ought to know that the sword has never ro discuss before the close of my remarks—but, bo- conciled differences of opinion. Military coercion fore taking it up, I propose to inquire for a mo- can never perpetuate the existence of this Union. ment whether, if the General Government has the When the affections of the people are withdrawn right, it should be exercised towards these States. from the Government, an attempt at coercion can Five millions of people have taken a position that have no other effect than to exasperate the people they have a right to throw off this Government, threatened to be coerced. Blood, shed in civil and have gone out of the United States. I will strife, can only enrich the soil that must speedily not debate the question whether they have suc- produce "a harvest of woe.”. ceeded, or whether they will succeed or not, but I Whether the Government of the United States desire to inquire whether Missouri believes, as in- has the power or not to coerce under the Constitutimated by two or three members on this floor, tion, I apprehend there is but one feeling, and that it would be right to coerce these States ? there ought to be but one in this Convention, and Think for a moment of an army marching upon that is, that that power ought not, and, in be the States in order to bring them into subjection. language of Kentucky and Virginia and other Let a Northern army invade the Southern States, slaveholding States, must not be resorted to. let them start from Ohio or New York, go down When an effort is made, all efforts to reunite the and attempt to bring those States into subjection. Government-all efforts for peace are at once gone. They may lay waste their cities, they may destroy Gentlemen of the Convention, the resolution that their people, they may succeed in battle, they is furnished by the Committec on Federal Relamay subjugate the country and destroy the inhabi- tions opposes coercion, and the amendment now tants, but tell me, then, if the Union is sustained; under consideration says that we will not furnish tell me, then, if those who are left to tell the men or money for that purpose. We have looked news will love the Northern States, after they at the effect of this question, and the ultimate have been scourged, and after the rivers have run destruction, beyond redemption, if coercion is with the blood of their kindred? Tell me how attempted. But we should not as a Convention long the earth will revolve on its axis, or time say that we will not furnish men or money if the roll on, till the Southern people will forget the Constitution of the United States authorizes the outrages of the Northern armies? The mother General Government to coerce a defaulting or will take her children to the grave of their seceding State. We should not pass this resolafather, and tell them that he was shot down while tion when the resolution itself would be unconhe was maintaining his rights against Northern stitutional, and this brings us to the question, fanatics: "Here lies his grave.” The grandchil- has the General Government the power under dren and the great grandchildren would be brought the Constitution to coerce a State? I have to it, and for ages their descendants would be told said that a State had constitutional that their ancestor was slain in defense of his right to secede. The Constitution has made no country; and while time rolled on, thousands of provision for the dissolution of the Union, and I years would not drive from their hearts the outra- will state, in addition to this, that while it has ges and injuries inflicted upon their sires. Never, made no provision for dissolving the Union, for never, can these States be brought back by the a State going out, it has withheld all provision

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and all power from the General Government to “The committee then rose, and the House adcoerce a state that puts itself in default. I desire journed.” to be understood in this affirmation. I affirm I need not read from the debates upon this subthat the Constitution does not make any provi- ject the reasons then given why force should not sion to coerce any State, North or South. Fortu- | be given to the Federal Government. After this nately for the country, these very questions were question had been fully debated, and the Convenconsidered and anticipated in the debates when tion had voted down the proposition to give the the Constitution was framed. We have left upon Federal Government the power to force a State, the record the testimony and debates of men who it was believed that the power should be given to framed the Federal Constitution. It was pro- negative the laws of States that came in conflict posed, in making that Constitution, when they with the General Government, and this question looked to the future and anticipated the troubles was debated at some length, and with great inthat might arise between the North and the terest. They said it was necessary to have some South, and between the different sections of the provision to bind the sovereign States together, Confederacy, and they felt that some power was and in case of violation by legislation or othernecessary. My friend from Pike yesterday said wise, that they might be controlled. But, when that the General Government had the power this question was considered, it was decided that to declare war, and, having the power to de. the mildest form of force ought not to be placed clare war, we ought not to pass a resolution in the Constitution, and it was withheld and vothat we would not aid.. I emphatically de- ted down. Can any gentleman affirm, then, that ay that the General Government has any power the power to coerce or declare war against a State to declare war against any State in this Union. is in the Constitution, when it was proposed and They gave the Government the power to declare voted down? It is not expressed--it is not imwar against a foreign nation, but when the propo- plied. The subject was debated; it was proposed, sition was made to give the power to declare war and it was rejected; and it is not in the ConAgainst a seceding State, it was denied. The stitution. Can any one say, then, that the very idea, to the framers of the Constitution, of General Government has the power to coerce a the General Government carrying the flag of the State? It is not expressed in the Constitution. country to subdue one member of the Confede- Is it implied? It was proposed, it was debated, racy—to subdue a sovereign State—was too hor- it was voted down, and then it cannot be implied. rible for them to entertain, and they voted it Will any man dare to take the position to neradown. It was still felt that something was neces- tive the laws passed by a seceding State? I tell sary to be done—that there should be some power you, when the Constitution was made, the subin the General Government to keep the sovereignject was proposed. That subject was considered, States in subjection, and the proposition was and our fathers decided it was a dangerous made to give all the authority to the Federal Gov- power and would destroy the Constitution itself. ernment to force the States into obedience-the No man can then affirm that the General Gopower of coercion--and upon that subject the de- vernment has the power either to declare war for bates sustain fally the position I have assumed, or against. No man can affirm that the Constithat it was a dangerous power that ought not tution, expressed or implied, authorizes the coerto be placed in the Federal Government. In the cion of any State in this Union. No man can Balison papers, 140, we have the following lan- affirm that the Constitution of the United Siates guage from Mr. Madison, on the question of give gives the power to negative any law or any act Lag the power of the Federal Government to forco passed by a sovereign State. It was proposed in 3 seceding State:

the Convention that framed the Constitution; it "Mr. MADISON observed, that the more he re

was debated and it was voted down. Mr. Ma

son, of Virginia, said that such power was danAerted on the use of force, the more he doubted

gerous to be placed in the Federal Government. the practicability, the justice, and the efficacy of it, when applied to people collectively, and not in

The most jarring elements of nature, fire and dividually. A union of the States containing

water themselves, are not more incompatible than

such a mixture of civil liberty and military exesuch an ingredient seemed to provide for its own

cution. Will the militia march from one State destruction. The use of force against a State would look more like a declaration of war than

into another, in order to collect the arrears of taxes an infliction of punishment, and would probably

from the delinquent members of the Republic? be considered by the party attacked as a dissolu

Will they maintain an army for this purpose ?

Will not the citizens of the invaded States assist tion of all previous compacts by which it might be bound. He hoped that such a system would

one another, till they rise as one man and shake

off the Union altogether? Rebellion is the only be framed as might render this resource unneces

case in which the military force of the State can sary, and moved that the clause be postponed.

be properly exerted against its citizens. In one “This motion was agreed to, nem. con. point of view, he was struck with horror at the prospect of recurring to this expedient. To pun- States-it would be dreadful enough to do this, ish the non-payment of taxes with death was a if the Constitution required, and if our honor and severity not yet adopted by despotism itself; yet our flag required us to go. That we should go into this unexamplel cruelty would be mercy com- a land where we were born, where the church pared to a military collection of revenue, in which yards are filled with our kindred, and where we the bayonet could make no discrimination be- should shed the blood of our kindred; and it tween the innocent and the guilty, He took this would be too horrible for human nature to con. occasion to repeat, that, notwithstanding his so- template the consequences. It is a spectacle at licitude to establish a national government, he which humanity, as this report says, would never would agree to abolish the State govern- shrink and fly away. I say Missouri never will ments, or render them absolutely insignificant. do it. Her Convention may say so, but its memThey were as necessary as the General Govern- bers will be compelled to select a commander ment, and he would be equally careful to preserve out of their own forces to fight their own battles. them. He was aware of the difficulty of drawing I tell you when an army engages in a war against the line between them, but hoped it was not in- the Constitution of the United States, against the surmountable. The Convention, though com- laws of the land, against humanity, the God prising so many distinguished characters, of battles that sustained Washington in the could not be expected to make a faultless govern- American Army, will be upon the side of that ment; and he would prefer trusting to posterity oppressed people, however wrong they may be, the amendment of its defects, rather than to push and victory in every battle will belong to them. the experiment too far."

Our friends in Illinois say, believing that LinMr. President and gentlemen of the Conven- coln intends coercion, you cannot do it. tion, we have arrived at the point, and we affirm They say you shall not do it. They that we have settled it beyond the power of refu- say our friends and kindred are in those States, tation, that this Federal Government cannot and we want this Government reunited, and march an armed force, by a declaration of war, it cannot be done if you commence coercing into a defaulting State--that it cannot coerce- those States, and, raise your army in Springfield that there is no power to negative a law. I must or Chicago, and attempt to march it into those confess that all the indications from the Govern- States, it will first have to march over our dead ment we are under seem to be to the effect that bodies. the present Chief Executive of the United States Will the Missouri Convention be less patriotic intended to start the doctrine of coercion, and all and less bold than the State of Illinois? They that has been said by that party in Congress, ex- say, we do not approve of the course of the cept a few, warrant me in the conclusion that it

South; we are sorry they have taken the step, was their setiled determination to coerce the but the North is in fault, and their orators say, Southern States. I trust they have abandoned in language not to be misunderstood, that it was that course. I trust, on examining the laws the election of a President upon a sectional platthey have to enforce, and the powers, that they form that nullified the Constitution and Southern will abandon it. But I affirm--acting the part of rights. Ohio speaks out through her two hunan humble member of the people of Mis- dred thousand Democrats, and they send greetsouri--that Abraham Lincoln cannot march ing North and South, not in language you have an army into one of the

States

heard upon this floor-not at all. They say to unless it is under the higher law. If he goes the North, put yourself right upon the record, there without the Constitution, without the sanc- repeal your obnoxious laws-put yourself right tion of law, he goes as an instrument to destroy before you complain of the action of the Southern the last hope of rebuilding or reconstructiong the States. Why is it, then, gentlemen of the ConUnion--and the sun of American liberty, as be- vention, that we cannot say to the North that fore remarked, will set behind a sea of blood. you have done slightly wrong--that we dare pot Then if he has no constitutional right, if the tell them of their errors? Why, is it that we will law forbid, can Missouri not have courage give offense? I want to speak like a man, I want enough in Convention; is she not old enough; is to speak in a conservative tone, and I want to there not patriotic blood enough in this Conven- give no offense to the North or South; but I want rion to stand by the rights of the Constitution of to demand what is right and submit to nothing the State of Missouri, to say that if you go under that is wrong, that will compromise the honor of th: higher law into that war, we will not aid you the State. in men or money. Why, it is strange that a man Gentlemen of the Convention, I am satisfied I that lives in a slaveholding State—it is strange am wearying your patience, and speaking longer that a man who believes our institutions are than I should, but I do not expect to trouble you right, could refuse to say that the sons of Mis again, and as my District has said but little in sowi will not engage in a war like this. It would this Convention, I desire to consider one or two be dreadful enough for us to go into these other questions. I pass over a number of extracts

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from these debates that I intended to have read, Is it intended by this Convention-is that the but I see it will take too much time. I desire, tone and sentiment that is to go North and bowever, to give the following resolution, which South-that if the Government is dissolved, if sras drawn by Mr. Jefferson:

two confederacies are established, that Missouri "Resolved, That the several States composing shall remain in the Northern Confederacy, and the United States of America are not united on prefer it to the South? That may be the sentithe principle of unlimited submission to their ment of every member of this Convention but General Government; but that by compact, under one. I assert in my place to-day, and I have the the style and title of a Constitution for the Uni- independence to do it--and I want that recorded ted States, and of amendments thereto, they con- now, and in all future time that if the other restituted a General Government for special pur- | maining slave States shall form a separate Conposes, delegated to that Government certain defi- | federacy-when all hope of reuniting the Goy. nite powers, reserving cach State to itself the re- ernment is gone, when the heart of the North siduary mass of right to their own self-governo that has been so cold has grown colder, and ment; and that whensoever the General Govern- | they shall say, in the language of Wade: “The ment assumes undelegated powers, its acts are day of compromise is past,” we have a great nainauthoritative, void, and of no force; that to tional victory upon a sectional platform, and we this compact each State acceded as a State, and are not anxious to compromise—then, I say, when is an integral party; that this Government, crea- that time shall come, when this Union is disted by this compact, was not made the exclusive solved, when there is a Northern and Southern or inal judge of the extent of the powers dele. Confederacy, then, for one, I am in favor of Misgated to itself, since that would have made its souri taking her stand with her Southern brethdiscretion, and not the Constitution, the measure eren in the Southern States. [Applause.] of its power; but that as in all other cases of The CHAIR. Those gentlemen who applauded compact among parties having no common must leave the galleries. Mr. Sergeant-at-Arms, judge, each party has an equal right to judge you will see that those gentlemen who have apfor itself as well of infractions as of the modeplauded will leave the galleries at once. I have and measure of redress.

requested gentlemen politely long enough, to reBut I propose to inquire for a short time what frain from demonstrations of this character, and Missouri should do and what position she should I will and must preserve order. o'cupy, that I might lay down before you what I Mr. Gantt. I hope that order will be limited think to be the desire of the people, and that I to those who have offended. may reflect their will, and that they may see that Mr. Bass. The time for adjournment has arI am carrying out my pledges and the promises I rived. I move that the Convention now admade to them. I regret, exceedingly, that the dis- / journ. tinguished gentleman that read the report has Mr. BIRCH. Before the motion is put, I desire said, or used the argument, that if Missouri should to present a report. connect herself with a Southern Condfederacy, it Mr. Moss. I hope the motion to adjourn will would be annihilation. I cannot think the one be withdrawn. It is not 12 o'clock. The gentle. hundred and seventy thousand freemen of this man who is now speaking will have time to get Sate, with friends in Illinois, Iowa and in Kansas; through. I cannot realize, that under these circumstances, Mr. Gantt. I hope so too. I think that by that this mighty State of ours can be annihila- having but one session a day, and by sitting here ted. I do not indorse the sentiment. I have all continuously without the interruption of an adrespect for that distinguished gentlemen, and the journment, we can get along with greater conCommittee which reported the resolution, but I venience to ourselves and better dispatch of busi, dlay the position assumed there, that if Missouri should connect herself with the Southern Con- Mr. Bass. I withdraw the motion to adjourn. federacy she would be annihilated. I am willing The Secretary then read the report as presented to admit, that if we connect ourselves with the by Mr. Birch, as follows: North-if there is a division, and the other four- The committee, appointed under a resolution of teen slave States shall form a Southern Republic, the Convention, adopted on the 11th inst., to inand we should go with the North, under those quire into the conspiracy which was deemed to circumstances, as I before remarked, we will sus- be foreshadowed in a communication that aptain a loss. If we go with the South we sustain peared in the Republican of that morning, rea loss, beyond all sort of doubt. Her taxes will port herewith a communication from Lewis V. be burdensome, and we shall have to endure many Bogy and from Wm. J. Chester, and respectfully privations that we do not experience at present. submit themselves to such further direction, if Seven States are out of the Union now, and oth- any, as the Convention may see fit to give them. ers are saying that, unless there are constitutional If, however, it shall be believed from these guarantees, they will go with the Southern States. statements that any purpose which may have

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existed to wrest the State from its legitimate relations to the Federal Government by illegal, perverse or revolutionary agencies, has been abandoned in deference to the unfaltering and overwhelming public sentiment with which it has been confronted, it is then further respect. fully submitted whether the interests of the public require that any further steps be taken, or any further investigations be prosecuted under the resolution of the Convention.

JAMES H. BIRCH,
CHAS. DRAKE,

Committee.
G. W. ZIMMERMAN,

ST. LOUIS, March 12, 1861. Messrs. BIRCI, ZIMMERMAN and DRAKE, Committee, &c., Present:

GENTLEMEN: I was summoned yesterday to appear before you, as a Committee, appointed by the State Convention now in session in this city, to testify to certain facts supposed to be within my knowledge. In appearing before you, I wish it distinctly understood that I do so voluntarily, as I deny both the power of the Convention, or that of a committee appointed by it, to summon any citizen of the State to appear before it as a witness; this power belongs to the Grand Juries of the country, and is a power need to ferret out crime by them; but entertaining, as I do, the greatest respect for the Convention as a body called into existence under a law of the State, and also for the members thereof personally, I waive what I consider my right as a citizen, and accordingly appear.

The publication which appe ared in the Missouri Republican, over the signature of E., is not substantially correct, as containing the substance of a conversation between me and the person who is supposed to be the author of it.

I have read the resolutions of the Convention and the speech of the mover of them, and I must confess that I am at a loss to understand how either could justify the charge made, based on the communication. In justice, however, to the persons who called me, and

who are charged with the crime of treason, I must say that I know nothing whatever to sustain

the charge. Certain gentleof standing in this city, and who are my personal and political friends, did call on me last week, with a paper which was very well written, setting forth that the time had come-in view of the fact that Virginia had, or would soon join the Southern Confederacy, and carry with her Kentucky and · the other Border States-for the friends of Southern rights to come together for consultation, and with a view of agreeing on some line of policy required by the exigercies of the times The conversation between these gentlemen and myself was of a desultory and general character, and it is with hesitation that I consent to trouble you with it, for it really amounts to nothing beyond a legitimate purpose of party organization in which there was nothing improper or wrong, and only with a view of making their action efficient. Although I dissented from them, as to the propriety of this course, yet my objection was not becau e there was anything wrong or improper in the proposition, but because I thought the movement was calculated to do harm, in view of the efforts now

being made to unite the Democratic and Bell parties on some common conservative ground to defeat the Black Republicans at the next April election. I furthermore explained to them that according to my understanding of the interests of Missouri, with twenty millions of State Bonds and six to eight mlllions of city and county Bonds on the markets of the world, and the great interests of the mercantile, manufacturing and industrial portions of the people, we should move, in a matter of this magnitude, with the greatest caution and prudence. Some of the gentlemen present charging me with inconsistency and as a blind follower of the Missouri Republican, I replied that the charge was not true, that I was a Southern man, and always had been, and was as much opposed to Black Republicanism as anybody could possibly be, but looking upon the effort as calculated to bring defeat upon us again at the next April election, I was opposed to their movement, and would do all in my power to defeat their purposes.

Much now might be repeated of the same nature, but the matter is too trivial to engage the attention of anybody. I certainly did not understand that any proposition was made to me looking like treason or conspiracy, or that can by any distortion of language or confusion of ideas, amount to the highest crime known to civilized nations. The subject was fair and legitimate, as a purpose for party organization by gentlemen of good standing, and as such I understood it, and opposed it for the reasons already given. My object in speaking of this occurrence to other parties was to get them to unite with me to prevent the proposed organization, believing, if successful, it would again lead to our defeat.

No one regrets this occurrence more than I do, 28 it is calculated to place other parties, as well as myself, in an unpleasant position.

The facts do not in the least justify the action of the Convention, the speech of the mover of the resolutions, or the comments of one of the city papers.

Repeating my sentiments of respect for the Convention, am, &c.,

LEWIS V. BOGY. N. B.-As the action of the Convention in relation to this matter has been the occasion of a good deal of talk in the city, to my prejudice, I have concluded to send a copy of this paper to the Missouri Republican for publication to-morrow morning, so that the matter may be set right before the community at

LEWIS V. BOGY.

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St. Louis, March 13. To Messrs. Birch, Drake and Zimmerman, Com

mittee of the Convention, &c.:

GENTLEMEN : Having appeared before you, in compliance with your subpæna, I proceed to make such a statement as you have requested of me, omitting the name of the person to whom I shall allude; and also declining to swear to any statement at the present time; but will not refuse to surrender the name of the person, or to swear to what I shall have stated, if required to do so by an order of the Convention.

On the second or third day of the session of your Convention in this place, I met with a gentleman, residing in one of the interior counties of the State, one whom I had known as a friend and

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