Imágenes de páginas
PDF
EPUB

vernment offices; but these were not the only stocks to fall back upon. There was a sum of £24,000,000 due from the Government to the savings banks, which they could convert into stock whenever it was deemed

vestment year by year. He had, however, I be £45,000. His hon. Friend said that one serious objection to the measure. The these annuities were held only by the Goright hon. Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer had always displayed an extreme willingness to reduce those taxes which were most open to complaint; but by passing this measure his right hon. Friend, and the House itself, would be pre-expedient to do so; therefore, they were not cluded from dealing fairly with those subjects in the Budget. His right hon. Friend might be called upon to reduce the fire insurance duty or other taxes which weighed prejudicially on the energies of the people; but if this Bill were passed, £180,000 a year would be added to the taxation of the country, and to that extent they would be precluded from an indulgent consideration of the imposts of the country. It appeared to him to be a strange time to select when 7 or 8 per cent was currently given for money, for discharging debts upon which they were only paying 3 per cent.

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER certainly could not at all complain that his hon. Friend, with the opinions he entertained, should object to the principle of the Bill; but, in considering the operation of the Bill, his hon. Friend entirely omitted to observe the effect of the former Bill. The practical effect was that one measure balanced the other. The object of the first Bill was to produce a true statement of the National Debt, by practically abolishing two funds precisely in the nature of the old Sinking Fund, which Parliament had long ago condemned. Its financial effect was to relieve the country from a very considerable annual charge, which was, of course, a set off, so far as it went, against the annual charge created by the present Bill. The Bill gave power to cancel £5,000,000 of perpetual annuities, and convert them into terminable annuities expiring in 1885; thereby creating, as his hon. Friend had said, a considerable additional annual charge in the interest of the National Debt until that year arrived. He held that it was a wise and provident proceeding in the actual circumstances of this country to use every fair and safe opportunity for the conversion of perpetual into terminable annuities, with a view to the reduction of the annual charge of the debt after a certain term of years. His hon. Friend seemed to think that the additional annual charge for the National Debt in the present instance was one of some magnitude, but it was not so; the whole amount of the increased charge occasioned by the two Bills would Mr. Hubbard

in the least under the necessity of considering whether the present stocks would be a good security for the savings banks. So much for the old savings banks; with respect to the new Post Office savings banks, they were receiving large deposits at 2 per cent.

The current never changed its direction for one moment, it was always setting inwards. Therefore, they were now under no necessity of considering any event so improbable as a total change of circumstances with respect to these institutions. Care would be taken to keep a considerable amount of convertible stock always in hand. If he were wrong in the opinion he held as to the expediency and wisdom of converting perpetual and terminable annuities, let the House interfere; but, if he were right, let them give effect to the measure proposed.

MR. ALDERMAN SALOMONS concurred with the right hon. Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer in the advisability of converting perpetual into terminable annuities; but hoped that the settlement of 1863 would not be disturbed, and that the right hon. Gentleman would insert some words in the Bill stating that there was no intention of interfering with the settlement without the sanction of Parliament.

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER said, it was not proposed to interfere with the settlement to which the hon. Gentleman alluded.

MR. HENLEY said, he quite believed in the soundness of the principle advocated by the right hon. Gentleman, but suggested the desirability of striking out in Committee the 4th clause, which gave unlimited power to the Treasury to carry out the same system in future. He thought that Parliament ought from time to time to be informed of the manner in which Government was acting.

MR. AYRTON wished to call the attention of the right hon. Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer to the fact that at the end of the twenty years the nation would still be indebted to the savings banks to its present amount, but he feared there would be no capital to represent the debt. He should like to know when the termin

able annuities came to an end, and there was a deficit of millions on the part of the savings banks, what security was to be provided for them.

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER said, the calculation had been made and the value had been fixed.

MR. AYRTON feared the amount was to be made a charge on the Consolidated Fund. He wished, however, to point out the fact that the reduction of the National Debt could not be effected by means of annuities terminable at the end of twenty years, for people would not be induced to buy them unless they ran for forty or fifty

years.

Motion agreed to.

Bill read a second time, and committed for Monday.

JAMAICA GOVERNMENT BILL.

LEAVE. FIRST READING.

MR. CARDWELL: Sir, in accordance with what I understand to be the opinion of the House, I will now proceed simply to lay the Bill for the Government of Jamaica upon the table of the House. I will make no statement with reference to the general subject, but merely state what are the contents of the Bill. The Bill will then be in the hands of Members, who will have the opportunity of perusing and considering it before they come to debate upon it. Now, Sir, it is in the knowledge of all those who have looked into the papers with reference to the late events in Jamaica, that the Ja maica Legislature in the first place passed an Act for the revision and re-construction of their own constitution; but upon receiv. ing from me an intimation that I should be ready to submit the question to the judgment of the House, if it were desired that I should do so, the Governor of Jamaica communicated that to the Jamaica Legislature, and that Assembly readily assented to the substance of a new form of constitution being left entirely in the hands of the Crown; and it is stated by the Governor in his despatch that the understanding of the Legislature was, that if passed by the Crown, it should be carried out in its full and plain meaning. Now, the course we took then was this:-It is our opinion that it would not be right to call upon the House, in the present state of its knowledge with respect to the colony of Jamaica, and while the inquiry that has been ordered into the recent events that have occurred there is pending, finally to determine what

the form of Government for the colony should be. We think that the wiser course would be to ask the House to ratify the measure which the Legislature of Jamaica itself has arrived at-that we should undertake the responsibility and duty of providing in the manner asked from us by the Legislature of Jamaica for the Government of the colony for a period. And the intention is that the House should agree, in the first instance, to the proposal of the Crown to substitute a Government similar to that now existing in Trinidad for that which has hitherto existed in Jamaica. We propose, then, to do that, with the permission and by the sanction of the House, by Order in Council. We propose the Bill should be in force for a limited period, and that that limited period should be for three years. That will enable the House to judge of the information which they will receive as the result of the Commission of Inquiry. It will enable them to judge whether the measures taken by Order in Council, as is proposed, for the purpose of re-constituting the Government of Jamaica, are wise and salutary measures, and likely to be productive of benefit to the colony. The House will then be called upon either to make the Bill perpetual, or to furnish some other form of Government, as in the judgment of the House may be deemed expedient and necessary. The provisions of the Bill then are simply to ratify for a limited period the measures at which the Jamaica Legislature has itself arrived. If I had time to make a statement of the grounds on which the Bill is proposed it would be evident to the House that I do not propose to make any change upon temporary grounds, but on grounds permanent in their character. I do not believe that it will be desirable at any period so proximate as to be within the scope of our present horizon, either to return to the old constitution of Jamaica, or to adopt a plan of a mixed representation and nominated Council like that which was enacted in the first Bill. As I said we propose the measure on permanent grounds, but we do not think it is fair or desirable to call upon the House finally to part with its control over the subject, with the information before us and the present investigation going on. The right hon. Gentleman then moved for leave to bring in a Bill to make provision for the Government of Jamaica.

MR. BAILLIE COCHRANE put it to the Government whether it would not be

better to wait till some information was received from the colony before introducing a Bill which would entirely change the whole constitution of Jamaica, with the possibility of having after a very limited period, perhaps six months, to re-construct that constitution over again?

MR. WALPOLE said, it was quite clear that the Government of Jamaica had abdicated its functions and placed the govern ment in the hands of the Crown, and it was consequently necessary to provide some other mode of government. Did the right hon. Gentlemen intend to specify in the Bill the kind of government that, by Order in Council, would be established in the colony. [Mr. CARDWELL: No!] Then he (Mr. Walpole) thought that the right hon. Gentleman would make some little mistake there. Parliament should consider the kind of Government they intended, by Order in Council, to establish in the colonies.

SIR JOHN PAKINGTON declined at that late hour to enter into a discussion of the Bill, but would raise no objection to its introduction.

After a few words from Mr. REMINGTON MILLS,

[blocks in formation]

EARL GRANVILLE read the following letter which he had received from the inspector specially sent down on the part of the Government to make inquiries with reference to the mode of treatment pursued at Baron Rothschild's farm :

MR. STEPHEN CAVE expressed his entire concurrence in the Motion just made by the Secretary of State. Although a change in the constitution of Jamaica had been forced upon them by recent events, yet some such measure as that now proposed by Her Majesty's Government had for many years past been deemed necessary by all who were conversant with the condition of the colony. As far back as 1839 the late Mr. Charles Buller expressed that opinion in the then House of Com-to mons. As it was intended to assimilate the constitution of Jamaica to that of Trinidad, he could only hope that the result of the change would be to render Jamaica as prosperous as that sister colony.

"Veterinary Department of the Privy Council

Office (Inspector's Office), Princes Street, London, S.W., Feb. 15, 1866. "Sir, I have the honour to inform you that, acting on your instructions, I yesterday went down Mentmore, the seat of Baron Rothschild, for the affected with cattle plague, as adopted by Mr. purpose of investigating the treatment of animals Worms. I found on the premises 118 head of cow. stock divided into several lots, but occupying yards sufficiently contiguous to each other as to afford great facilities for the spread of any infectious disease. Until Friday last, February 9, the whole of the animals had continued in perfect health; but on this day a heifer, one of a lot of The

Motion agreed to. Bill to make provision for the Government of twenty-four, gave indications of illness. Jamaica, ordered to be brought in by Mr. SECRE-Veterinary surgeon, Mr. Lepper, of Aylesbury, who TARY CARDWELL and Mr. WILLIAM EDWARD FOR- earlier symptoms of cattle plague, and as such was called to the case, recognized some of the the care of Mr. Worms. Notwithstanding all the the animal was placed as soon as possible under

STER.

Bill presented, and read the first time. [Bill 17.]

MINES.

Select Committee appointed, "to inquire into the operation of the Acts for the regulation and inspection of Mines, and into the complaints contained in Petitions from Miners of Great Britain with reference thereto, which were presented to the House during the last Session." (Mr. Ayrton.)

Mr. Baillie Cochrane

attention which it received it died on the fourth day of the attack. On Saturday, the 10th instant, two other heifers were also said to be attacked with the plague, and consequently were placed aside by themselves. On Monday one, Tuesday four, and Wednesday (the day of my visit), three more of the herd were removed as being likewise the subjects of the plague. The ten animals were also placed under the care of Mr. Worms, who has

since superintended all the details of their treat-lutely necessary, considering the present ment and general management. The early cases state of the country, to ask for the suspenwere reported to me as having been cured, and sion of the Habeas Corpus Act. Her Majesthe others as going on most satisfactorily. It required but little knowledge of the diseases of cattle ty's Government have therefore resolved to to at once see that none of the ten animals make the proposal to suspend the Act, and had been, or were, the subjects of any serious the Secretary of State for the Home disease; and, after giving to each of them a care- Department will do so to-morrow in the ful examination, I failed to detect the slightest other House of Parliament. When a symptom of cattle plague in any one of them. Whether plague will, under the peculiar circum- similar Motion was last made, the Bill was stances of the case, be developed in the herd re- introduced at twelve o'clock on a Saturday, mains to be seen, but should the opinion of Mr. and passed through all its stages in the Lepper be correct as to the cause of the death of course of that day. Your Lordships will the first animal, only a few days can pass without determining the point.—I have the honour to be, doubtless agree that, if the necessity for Sir, your obedient servant, such a course exists, no time should be lost; and I must, therefore, ask your Lordships to put yourselves to the inconvenience of meeting to-morrow at four o'clock, when the matter shall be laid before you.

66 'JAMES B. SIMONDS.

"The Clerk of the Council."

THE EARL OF ELLENBOROUGH asked the noble Earl whether, in connection with this subject, he would consent to lay on the table a copy of a letter which had been published in the newspapers, he apprehended by the authority of the Government, about three weeks after the plague first broke out. It was from the Consul at Warsaw, stating that a disease had broken out in Poland in 1857, such as was represented now to exist in this country, but in no case did it extend itself to any part of the country where the water was impregnated with iron, and that cures had been effected in other parts of the country by giving animals water in iron vessels. He was astonished to find that a letter so remarkable had failed to attract public attention, and that so simple a method of treatment had not been resorted to, at all events, experimentally.

EARL GRANVILLE said, that the noble Earl's suggestion should not be forgotten, but did not anticipate any very favourable results from the course of treatment indicated in the letter.

THE EARL OF ELLENBOROUGH said, he had met the other day a gentleman who had lost a good many cattle by the plague, and on mentioning the Consul's letter to him he said it was a remarkable fact that an animal which had been in the habit of drinking from an iron vessel was the only

animal he had saved.

HABEAS CORPUS SUSPENSION

THE EARL OF DERBY: The proposal made by the noble Earl indicates a very serious state of affairs. Of course, it will be for Her Majesty's Government to justify to this and the other House of Parliament the course proposed; and if the other House should be so satisfied of the gravity of the occasion-and no doubt they will have sufficient evidence laid before themas shall induce them to consent to take so strong a step as suspending all the Standing Orders for the purpose of passing the suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act, I am quite sure your Lordships will be unanimously of opinion that in such a state of affairs it would be neither expedient, desirable, nor consistent with your duty to interpose a moment's delay. Therefore, my Lords, as far as I am concerned, if the House of Commons should think fit to suspend all their Standing Orders for the purpose of passing a Bill, which I presume it is the intention of the Government to lay before them during the morning sitting of to-morrow, I should offer no opposition to it when it is laid before your Lordships in company with a statement from Her Majesty's Government, and backed up by the authority of the House of Commons. And when I say I should be prepared to assent to the passing of the Bill under the circumstances, I trust we shall have at the earliest possible opportunity such a statement from Her Majesty's Government as will justify us in having passed so strong a measure as that proposed.

(IRELAND)-NOTICE. EARL RUSSELL: My Lords, I have to ask your Lordships to sit to-morrow in consequence of the condition of affairs in Ireland. The Lord-Lieutenant, on the advice of the Lord Chancellor of Ireland, the Chief Secretary, and other persons, has expressed the opinion that it is abso-ing the attention of Her Majesty's Go

LIFEBOATS ON THE COAST.
MOTION FOR A RETURN.

OBSERVATIONS.

THE EARL OF MALMESBURY, in draw

vernment to the Deficiency of Lifeboats coast was unprovided with a lifeboat where and other Means of saving human Life one was needed, or there were a sufficient on the Coasts of Great Britain and Ire-number of resident fishermen and boatmen land, desired to state that any obser- to justify one being provided. Mr. Lewis, vations he might make had no reference the Secretary of the Institution, had called to any particular Member of Her Majesty's upon him and left him a map of Great BriGovernment, but to the Government as a tain, which showed where lifeboats were whole; and he would express the opinion stationed, and also indicated where wrecks that it felt less deeply than it should the had taken place. From this chart he found necessity of providing means for the pre- that on a most dangerous part of the coast servation of human life upon the coast. of Scotland no lifeboat was stationed, and The present stormy season had produced on the west coast of Ireland only one lifeample evidence that the means provided boat was stationed from the north to the were insufficient; and he would parti- south. This conclusively showed, in his cularly direct the attention of the noble opinion, that the Society had not sufficient Duke at the head of the Admiralty (the machinery at its command completely to Duke of Somerset), as well as the President do the work it proposed to itself. On Sunof the Board of Trade, to that statement. day last the storm which swept the EngIt was remarkable that this great maritime lish Channel was one of the heaviest ever country, having the largest Royal and mer- known, the wind blew at a strength of cantile fleet in the world, should, until a 40lb. upon the square inch, while the few years ago, have been so deficient in this maximum pressure in Great Britain seldom respect. In 1850 only twelve lifeboats exceeded 30lbs. or 35lbs. The coast bewere employed upon the coast of Great tween Poole and the Solent was much Britain. Since then, they had largely exposed, and only one lifeboat was staincreased in number; but in all cases they tioned there. Near where he resided, at had been built, kept in repair, and navi- Christchurch, there were open roadsteads, gated at the expense of private persons. exposed to southerly and westerly winds. The subscriptions collected from charitable On Sunday, when the storm was at its persons by the Royal National Society for height, a brig was in danger, some 200 or this purpose amounted to about £30,000 300 yards from shore. It was thought no a year. Of the noble institutions that had common boat could live in the sea that been established in this country, none was raged there; but a gallant act was permore noble, or more creditable to the formed by some men in a fishing-boat, honour of England than this. The Insti- who put off and saved four of the crew of tution, notwithstanding it was supported seven. The rest died from exhaustion; by voluntary contributions, and received but every fisherman on the coast was ready no aid from the State, had done wonders. to declare, that if succour had reached During the past twenty years, or some those men earlier, they would all have been similar period, it had been instrumental saved. Why, then, was there no lifeboat in saving 15,000 lives. The leading at Christchurch? He found on referring to the chart that Christchurch had been transplanted to the mouth of the Southampton Water, and if the position assigned to it had only been correct, of course no lifeboat would have been required. He also learnt that the officer of the Coastguard had been asked if there was a sufficient number of boatmen in the neighbourhood to manage a lifeboat, and that his answer was that there were sufficient boatmen, but none who could be depended upon in case of emergency, unless they were remunerated for their services. He also stated that he did not know how an honorary committee could be formed among the neighbouring gentry for the purpose of managing the lifeboat station. He certainly could assert that, as far as he himself was concerned, he had never been asked to

members of the Institution had told him that they would still rather continue to be left to themselves-that they wanted no subsidy, or other assistance from Government, and they believed that a subsidy would diminish their contributions. He (the Earl of Malmesbury) was rather astonished at that statement, because he had always found that when subscriptions were asked for, people were ready to give if certain others would contribute also. But the great question was, whether, with all its zeal and activity, the Institution was capable of fulfilling the duties which it took upon itself. The members believed that it was, and they had such confidence in it that, quoting the returns of the Coastguard officers, Lloyd's agents, and others, they declared that no part of the The Earl of Malmesbury

« AnteriorContinuar »