STATEMENT OF JOHN SUNCHILD, CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, NATIONAL TRIBAL DEVELOPMENT ASSOCIATION, BOX ELDER, MT Mr. SUNCHILD. Good afternoon. Can you hear me? I want to thank the Senate committee, namely, Mr. Campbell and Mr. Wellstone. Also the St. Thomas College and also a new found friend this morning, John Poupart. He's the president of the research institute here in the college. I welcome the students. And I welcome the Indian people of Minnesota and Wisconsin. And I'm glad to be here. But, namely, I have what I call the National Tribal Development Association. It's composed and started out with 15 tribes and started with getting a lot of frustration out and overcoming the obstacles for developing the necessary prerequisites to sustain reservation economic development and economic ventures in the Indian country. They were spinning their wheels and not gaining, not going anywhere. And based on that, you know, I made certain initiatives. First of all, you know what I do with the--I now have 32 members of the tribes. What I do is I have a profile of all of their economic ventures on the web. And I'm working toward what I call Internet marketing for these 32 tribes; marketing Native American tribes. And that is the function of the National Tribal Development Association. But I'm here to discuss something more important. We've been discussing it for the past two centuries, past 200 years, tribal governments have been left out of the economic picture. And we will look at some examples, you know, the Reclamation Act of 1902 and provided huge amounts of money for irrigation districts to create irrigation districts and water projects throughout the non-Indian country; Indian people were left out. More recently the creation of legislation got into enterprise zones for major cities throughout this country and rural areas. Again, Native American governments were left out. When enterprise communities were created, legislated, again, Indian governments were left out. But down here today rather than to dwell on the past, we need to learn from our mistakes and begin to work in a true government-to-government partnership to rectify the wrongs and provide the opportunities for Indian tribes to sustain viable economies and homelands in Indian country. I am here today to discuss with the committee of my concerns on the unmet needs of physical infrastructure. We pride ourselves on the success of those tribes having gained economic stability. But many of those tribes still lack those basic needs to establish an economic base, to attract industry or form their own economic ventures. I am reminded of a statement made by Senator McCain in September 17, 1997; it alluded to five principles to use as a guide for economic ventures in Indian country. He said: No. 1, Native Americans should have the same rights for economic opportunity that other Americans have. No. 2, the best solutions for Native American economic develop No. 3, the Federal Government has an important role to play in supporting the development of reservation economics. No. 4, tribal government should be avoiding being a carbon copy of the autocratic and inefficient bureaucracy-pardon me for saying that. No. 5, the brightest economic future lies in the open free enterprise system on the reservation land. We have the land, which is a must for economic development. We have human resources to provide jobs for under what economic development that we can muster into the reservation, but we must have a strong independent sovereign base. In 1995, under the National Tribal Development Association, in looking out at the country, I commissioned a survey of the unmet needs of tribes on infrastructure. And I commissioned Eugene Begay out of Eagle Associates, Minnesota. And, Mr. Chairman, at this time I'd like for that survey to be a matter of record. The CHAIRMAN. Without objection we will include that in the record, as long as you promise not to read it. Mr. SUNCHILD. You got it. What I found was that the majority of tribes-and this is true-the majority of tribes do not have or possess administrative staff or experience in business or possess the database to adequately respond to a survey of distinction. These tribes are usually small with a small population and usually in a low area. A majority of these tribes have not advanced sufficiently in their development to incorporate, to prioritize business in economic development, because most of these tribes are too busy, too busy struggling just to maintain to provide basic services to their people; in education, housing, health and human services. Empowerment zone legislation to us, Indian people, the benefits to Indians is reams and reams and stacks of it. There are millions of dollars sitting over there for empowerment zones to say that in lieu of a white man coming to a reservation to establish economic development is given tax breaks, accelerated tax, depreciation on equipment. To us, it is the whole 49 or 51 percent opposition of joint ventures. That's all it really is. Yet, there are a thousand lights that are lit throughout this country in major cities to create employment, to create industry, jobs, in these areas. The CHAIRMAN. We're running really over our time. I hate to cut you off, Mr. Sunchild. Mr. SUNCHILD. Right now, I hope your staff reads through this because this is important information. And to me this document here requests a lot of money for infrastructure because without roads, without railroads, without education, without water, without sewer systems and an adequate court system that addresses corporate law, business law, we cannot attract a non-Indian industry to the reservation. [Prepared statement of Mr. Sunchild appears in appendix.] The CHAIRMAN. We're going to move on to Mr. Martin. STATEMENT OF JAMES T. MARTIN, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, UNITED SOUTH AND EASTERN TRIBES, NASHVILLE, TN Mr. JAMES MARTIN. Chairman Campbell, Senator Wellstone, it is a privilege to be here at the University today with the audience to problem of being last because I'll be echoing a lot of the comments already made so, therefore, I will go straight to the points that I wanted to make. I am an enrolled member of the Poarch Band of Creek Indians of Alabama. I am the executive director of the USET, United South and Eastern Tribes, Inc., an inter-tribal organization consisting of 23 federally recognized Indian tribes from 12 States. We're grateful for the opportunity to appear before this committee today to speak upon economic development in Indian country, truly a subject that is vital to our tribes and to virtually every tribe in the United States. As we are running so long now, it is a long subject, an Indian complex subject. So I want to concentrate particularly on the tools that a tribe, I believe The CHAIRMAN. Can you pull that microphone up closer to you? Mr. JAMES MARTIN. I would like to concentrate on the tools that, I believe, the tribes and the Federal Government need to work on together that would stimulate economic development opportunities on the reservation. As you said in your opening comments, and virtually every presenter thus far touched on tribal sovereignty. And so my main point is tribal sovereignty, to begin with. Last year, Congressman Archer tried to put on a tax that_was going to confiscate 34 percent of the revenues of the tribes. That was devastating, in any tribe. It would devastate any industry if they had to turn over 34 percent of their revenues outright. If the Government is serious about maintaining, not expanding, but simply maintaining the economic development that has come about in Indian country, they need to leave tribal sovereignty intact and stop attacking it every chance they get. The next point is to honor the trusted responsibilities, as the gentleman spoke of, the infrastructure of every tribe, for most tribes are hanging by a thread. They have not what I call critical mass. If you will look at every tribe that has been successful in the economic development today, they have achieved a level of critical mass in their infrastructure so they can have time for staff to devote to doing zoning plans, doing economic development plans. But far too often our tribes have to concentrate on fighting the Congress, fighting the State to try to get the money that we feel should be coming to us on a regular basis, on an annual basis to educate our people, to house our citizens. They never have time to concentrate on economic development. They spend all of the time trying to maintain what little advances we have been able to make over the years. The other areas to try to improve, meaningful tax incentives in Indian country. The Internal Revenue Code 7871, provides for tax free bond to which, as Ms. Anderson said, their tribes were successful in issuing of those bonds. But far too often, tribes cannot issue those bonds because it's so complex and the requirements that are put on them that in order to issue the bond and make that bond be tax-exempt, the financing of the activity going on has to employ so many of the tribal members that tribes cannot mediate because tribes do not have a level of competent, educated workers that are members of their tribes to go into. I believe it has to change where this tax incentive can be offered time where they can employ non-Indian people, and Indian people. But then a transition to allow more tax incentives as they create more jobs for Indian people over the long haul, not instantaneously. If you don't employ them right off, you don't get the tax incentive. The final point is to work on the infrastructure. Both the Senate and House just passed reorganization bills for the ISTEA, intermodal surface transportation. We are going to embark on a tremendous amount of money going to build the infrastructure and roads for our cities and small towns. Every one of our reservations, bar none, needs that same type of assistance. Before a reservation can be attractive to industry, they have to have the infrastructure: Roads, sewer, water systems that is needed by almost every industry. My home State of Alabama, where my tribe is located, went and started a Prepared Cities Program. And that is where Prepared Cities Programs went to and identified the small municipalities who did not have infrastructure in their communities in place to attract economic development, provided economic development grants to those cities so that they can put in place those economic development infrastructures, so that those countries could be more attractive to the outside businesses. Every one of our tribes would much rather work in partnerships with the Federal Government and with the State government to create economic development. But we cannot do that when we are constantly fighting the battles we were having to fight recently, which is to protect the gains we've made thus far and continue trying to protect our sovereign immunity. USET has some of the most successful economic development tribes in Indian country. They truly understand for them to be successful, they have to interact with the local community, with the State community and the national community. It is a complex problem but I think it's a problem that can be achieved and overcome through partnership and an understanding of mutual respect of both parties' sovereignty price. Thank you. [Prepared statement of James Martin appears in appendix.] The CHAIRMAN. Thank you. While you were testifying, I was jotting a few notes myself to get my own recollection of what we've done the last decade back there. Years ago, speaking to John Sunchild, Bill Richardson and I who is now the Ambassador of the United Nations were on the same committee. At that time we introduced a bill just to what you said, to try to name Indian reservations as economic enterprise zones so that corporations would get a tax break to be able to work, you know, a tax break to have cooperative agreements with tribes. We couldn't get that passed. In fact, the administration wouldn't support it. I don't know who was working behind the scenes, whether it was the banks or who, but we couldn't get that passed. It was a good idea at the time. We have done some things that have kind of taken up the slack in the years, as you probably know. And speaking of the ISTEA Act, you know that was roughly $215 billion that was $215-well, in fact, the total amount, the total bill was about a $215-billion bill-a huge bill. Of that, we ear just me alone but Senator Wellstone and a bunch of us worked to make sure that there was a $50-million increase for Indian tribes for a total $250 million per year. And part of that will be through the normal ISTEA process. I forgot the exact dollar amount, will be direct tribe funding to the tribe. And, no, that's not a lot but it helps. When you compare that as an example $250 million to the Nation's Indian tribes compared to just what we're spending now to keep our ships, planes, and airplanes in the Middle East, we are now up to $400 million a month. We're spending that much a month to keep our Armed Services in the Middle East. So what we put in the Indian community is really pretty insignificant to where we're spending other money. I just wanted to point that out. And I know that there have been, you know, that when you talk about the success of Indian tribes through gaming here and other types of ventures, we're talking about a small number of us. As I understand it, really only about 1 out of 20 who have started gaming, as an example, are successful. Some are just barely making it to provide jobs, you know, some help to the community. But many of them, in fact, are not making money; some of them have already gone into receivership. And I think the unfortunate thing is that there seems to be an attitude that this feeling nationwide that maybe is fueled by the media. And they have taken some pictures and talked with the casino in Connecticut or one of the very successful tribes, maybe at Stone Lake or something, and they automatically assume, boy, all those Indians must be getting rich; they're all loaded. And you know as well as I do, that's not the case. We still have the highest incidence of poverty, unemployment, high school dropout, suicide, anything that you can name that you would not like in a culture. And the Indian unemployment rate is five times or more worse than the non-Indian communities. So I know I don't have to tell you that, you're already aware of that. I thought I would re-enforce that. In our hearing in Seattle-in fact, it was a gentleman who spoke for the Southern Ute Tribal Council and he talked about some of the backlash that seems to be building toward Indians because a few of them are successful. And he put it very distinctly when he said, "they liked us better when we were poor." But that's not the way America is supposed to work. It's supposed to be everyone's opportunity to get ahead, take care of the family and get the bills paid. Let me ask a couple of questions before I ask Senator Wellstone, and he may have some. You mentioned, Marge, the importance of drawing lines between politics and business. And I know from being an enrolled member of the Northern Cheyenne Tribe myself, that sometimes modern practices of government and business come in conflict with traditional values and traditional ways of doing things and cultural ways of doing things. Now, we've had a couple of times tribal leaders who have actually been indicted for taking gifts. Now, in the outside world, the Government world in Washington, DC or State government or any |