I want you to understand that the history of the Unification Church in this country has not been an easy one. It has been very difficult.

Senator HATCH. Reverend Moon, I understand how deeply you feel, and your strong feelings about the way your church has been treated, from your viewpoint and perspective by our Government, including the IRS, the prosecutors, and of course, the courts.

Do you also feel that you have been mistreated by the American people themselves, apart from governmental mistreatment?

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. When I came to America, I certainly anticipated opposition, because I do not support the status quo, but am calling for changes based on a God-centered world view.

However, I do not blame the American people. I believe in the American people. I love the American people. An incredibly distorted image of me has been created in their minds as a result of the media and the government. Accurate information has not been given out to the people. Therefore, the American people themselves have been victimized. They have been denied the truth about the Unification movement.

On this occasion I would like to say, however, that you Mr. Chairman, are one great American who has understood and supported me.

Senator HATCH. Thank you, Reverend Moon.

I would like to ask you one more question, and I want you to know that I am fully aware of your ongoing litigation, and will understand if you prefer not to answer, until you have had time to consult with your lawyers.

But I would like to know, just for the record here today, were you or were you not the owner of the Chase Manhattan Bank funds and the stock that you were accused of owning in the Government's case against you? And if not, who did that money and stock belong to?

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. Mr. Chairman, I would like to ask all the good people in this room a common sense question. If you want to conceal funds from the Government, would you bring them to the Chase Manhattan Bank and open an account in your name? I do not think so. If you really want to defraud the Government, or cheat the Government of taxes, you would rather go to Switzerland or the Cayman Islands and coneal the money in a secret account.

Why did the Government make such an implausible charge against me? The Government has been trying for a long time to find some grounds to accuse me. This was the only thing they could find, but it is absolutely not true.

The money and the stock in question belong to the Unification Church. In the early pioneering days of our movement in the United States, the church leaders asked me to permit my name to be used for the initial account of our international church movement. For them, my name is the embodiment of the church. I told them that if they wanted to do it that way, I would give them permission.

Later in 1976, when our church had established a foundation in this country, that account was transferred over to the official corporation known as the Unification Church International. In

other words, the Chase Manhatten Bank account opened in my name was transferred in its entirety to the account of the Unification Church International. Those funds continue to be used for the sake of the world mission of the Church, precisely as the donors intended.

It is my understanding that what I have done is a common practice in this country. The leaders of mainline churches do this as a matter of routine. Furthermore, it is my understanding, and I hope I am not mistaken, that in the Catholic Church, it is even required to have certain property under the church leader's name, the socalled Corporation Sole.

This being the case, what I have done was absolutely normal and proper, but the Government could not find any other grounds for prosecution. It appears to me that they have used this charge as a pretense for exploiting my unpopularity in this country. That is what precisely happened, Mr. Chairman.

Senator HATCH. Thank you.

We are honored to have the ranking minority member of this committee with us today. Senator DeConcini, I will be happy to turn the time to you.

Senator DECONCINI. Mr. Chairman, thank you, and let me thank the chairman as usual for his willingness to extend the committee. I would also like to thank the Reverend Moon for testifying here on this very important subject matter.

I do have a few questions.

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. There are a number of oring now in your church in the United States and in other countries? Do you have a number of followers or registered members.

Reverend Moon [through interpreter]. There are a number of organizations which I have inspired as part of the Unification Movement. The Unification Church, or Holy Spirit Association for the Unification of World Christianity, has a worldwide following of 2.5 million people. Because this number is continuously growing, we commonly cite it as a membership of three million.

At the same time, an organization which I created to fight against Communism on a worldwide basis has chapters in 120 nations and a following of over 20 million people. We expect this figure to go up to 70 million in the next couple of years.

Senator DECONCINI. How many members of the Unification Church do you have in the United States?

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. Roughly, about 30,000 dedicated members.

Senator DECONCINI. And is that growing?

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. Yes, each day.

Senator DECONCINI. And do your religious beliefs, Reverend Moon, subscribe that the State or the Government has the right to insist on taxes being levied against employees or ministers of the church as individuals?

Colonel PAK. Senator, would you repeat that question, please? Senator DECONCINI. Yes. Do your religious beliefs, under the Unification Church, subscribe or believe that the State or the Government has the right to impose, or insist on levying taxes on the income of individuals who are employees or ministers, or part of the church?

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. Our church members are obligated to pay taxes, including income taxes, to the local government and the Federal Government.

Senator DECONCINI. I am concerned, Reverend Moon, because I have on many occasions objected to some of the tactics of the IRS. On the other hand the Internal Revenue Service has been attributed with many convictions on tax cases from individual Americans who have escaped many other alleged offenses. I wonder if in your judgment or opinion, your feel that the Internal Revenue has sought to bring action against you for violating our income tax laws, because of any other actions, other than the religious affiliation of your church?

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. As the other witnesses already testified, there has been an incredible encroachment by the IRS into every phase of human life in this country. In the case of the Unification Church, for some reason, we have been an extraordinary target.

We can only speculate as to why they are doing it, but they are doing it. For example, IRS agents came to our church and stationed themselves for several years in our church building. We provided them with office space while they scrutinized our church operations. This is highly unusual, and there are many other examples of unreasonable treatment of our Church by the United States Government through the agency of the IRS.

In my own tax situation, for example, in order to be certain that I adhered to the law, I employed a very prominent CPA, Price Waterhouse, as an advisor. I also had more than one lawyer advising me. I did not want to make any mistakes. Still the IRS came after

me.

Senator DECONCINI. Did those firms recommend that the accounts be in your name?

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. When I came to this country for the first time, I could not even understand one word of English. I was helpless. I was relying on professionals, the best professionals available in this country, and I followed their advice every step of the way. According to them, there was absolutely nothing improper in what I was doing.

Senator DECONCINI. Except in the face of the law now, and the conviction, appeal has been had. In fact, they turned out to be wrong, your advisors, is that not correct?

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. The Government's action is improper and unjust, and this is the very reason the religious community is protesting.

In other words, if this can be done to me, then no one in this country is safe. You just give me your tax return, they have a way to prosecute you tomorrow.

[Pause.]

Senator DECONCINI. I appreciate, Reverend Moon, the great amount of authority and power that the Internal Revenue Service has, but I also appreciate the American system of justice, where we are tried by our peers, by jurors, and you had such a trial, did you not? And is there not a distinction between a jury trial and the

Were you not protected by the fact that you had your day in court, with ample opportunity to refute the charges, to be heard by a jury of peers, of American citizens, and yet they came to the conclusion that indeed there was a violation of the law?

It seems to me that there are two different problems here. One, that maybe the Internal Revenue picking on you because they dislike you, which is unfair, and should not happen. And yet the other is the criminal justice system that tries people, in a manner that I think is probably the most impartial way of any country, of which I know I do not know of a better way, and it seems like we ought to distinguish the two issues, and focus perhaps only on the Internal Revenue Service, and not on the criminal justice system. They must be distinguished because if you say that you have been persecuted by the criminal justice system, you have been persecuted by the American people, and you have testified that you do not feel that way rather that it is the Government that has done something wrong to you.

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. Mr. Senator, I do still have respect for the American judicial system, but I have great misgivings about the deeds of the Government, not only the IRS, but also the Justice Department, the prosecution, and others.

For example, if I understand correctly, although I am sure that Constitutional scholars can answer you much better than I, the jury system in this country is organized for the added protection of the defendant.

In my case, I did not want a jury trial. I claimed this as a constitutional right. I did not want that trial. I wanted to be judged strictly by the law, as interpreted by a good judge. I spoke out and the Government punished me by forcing a jury trial upon me. What king of justice is that? Instead of protecting me, they used the Constitution against me.

Senator DECONCINI. Are you saying that a trial by one single person, a judge, is a more fair trial than a trail by a jury of impartial citizens? [Laughter.]

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. Not in every case, Mr. Senator, but in my case. The Government knew that they could only convict me by exploiting my unpopularity before a jury. During the trial, they introduced a great deal of disinformation about my ministry. Then they appealed to the jury for a verdict of guilty. Do you think that a jury of citizens is always impartial? Jesus Christ got a jury trial, and he got the verdict. [Applause.] Senator DEČONCINI. Well, Mr. Moon-

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. This is the reason I wanted to be tried by a judge.

Senator DECONCINI. Mr. Moon-

Senator HATCH. If we could, Senator DeConcini

Senator DECONCINI. You may make any questions you want between your leadership and Jesus Christ, but I take offense to that. We are not here comparing religions. We are here trying to find out something about this system.

Senator HATCH. Let me interrupt for a second, Senator DeConcini.

Now, I would I like no further disturbances, and no further emotion.

Senator DECONCINI. I thank the chairman.

Senator HATCH. The Senator is asking some very good questions. Senator DECONCINI. Mr. Chairman, I am not here to antagonize Reverend Moon nor his followers nor this audience, but I think it is disgraceful for that attitude to permeate in this so-called freedom of religion discussion we are having here this morning, and I thank the chairman for bringing it to order.

My point is this, I have read about this case, and I have some very deep qualms about the Internal Revenue Service, as I have had for many years, I realize that the Government is run by people, and that people have certain basis, but I find a contradiction here, Reverend Moon, in that you indicate that our jury system that is provided by the Constitution is not acceptable to you.

I suspect had that jury system found you not guilty, you would find it very acceptable. It seems to me that if your complaint here, is that someone has picked on you, and done something that they should not, it ought to be an inquiry into the Justice Department and Internal Revenue Service, and not casting blame upon the jury that tried you unless you have some proof that the jury was tampered with, or that there was some violation of the law on the part of the prosecutor or the investigator as they related to individual jurors.

I have not yet heard that view, nor have I seen that reported, in all the coverage of your trial. I think it is important that we inquire whether or not you are calling into question the fair jury trial in your case, or our criminal justice system.

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. May I say this to you, sir, that prior to the jury trial, we had an objective professional company conduct a survey of public opinion with regard to Reverend Moon's case. It turned out that 60 percent of the people who participated in the survey said that they would convict Reverend Moon regardless. I ask you, Mr. Senator, under those circumstances, if you were in my position, would you like to have a jury trial?

Senator DECONCINI. My answer to that is, I would ask for a dif ferent forum, and a different place to have the trial, maybe that was petitioned by your attorneys, I do not know.

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. I want you to understand that the media has really done a thorough job. There is no place where I could have a fair trial.

Senator DECONCINI. If that is the case, then I take it that you set yourself apart from all other citizens, based on the publicity and the media presentation of your church and your problem, and that therefore it was impossible to have a fair trial in the United States of America, is that a fair statement?

Reverend MOON [through interpreter]. That is why I requested to be tried by a judge. As I said, I believe in the judicial system of this country. I thought I could have a fair trial by a judge.

When I was indicted, I was in Korea. I returned to this country to face trial even though Korea and the United States had no extradition treaty. Because I am innocent. I wanted to stand trial. Of course, I wanted to get a fair trial. I wanted to be vindicated. That was what I desired.