STATEMENT OF HON. IVAN SIDNEY, CHAIRMAN, THE HOPI TRIBE,

KYKOTSMOVI, AZ Mr. SIDNEY. Thank you.

Chairman Inouye and Senator McCain, I bring you greetings from the Hopi people.

Mr. Chairman, I am very much encouraged by your remarks about what is happening here in Washington today and that any issue, no matter how difficult, can be resolved. A lot of times, we are all affected by issues that are subject to laws. We as Americans are law-abiding citizens. However, at times, laws are difficult for some of us, but they are something we enjoy in our democracy. I feel inspired by what is happening in Washington that we can move forward and resolve an issue that has been around a very long time.

Mr. Chairman, I want to congratulate you and your staff on your effort to visit both the Navajo and Hopi Nations. You have personally talked to the people affected.

Senator McCain, I want to congratulate you as well as Senator DeConcini, our two Senators from Arizona, on what you are trying to do to help resolve this issue.

Mr. Chairman, I believe the Hopi Tribe also has been afflicted by tremendous hardship, a hardship that has been felt for many years, many years beyond the coming of other tribes, which is supported by many documents in many museums in this country. I believe that up to today, we have recognized what has happened. We have stood on the position that the law is the law, but it is a law that we can work with.

I have a lot of older people on Hopi, and these elders come to me and say we must repeal the law so we can get all of the Hopi lands back. It is very difficult for me to explain to them that to repeal the law, we are going to talk about all of the Navajo lands, including the 1868 treaty reservation, and I don't think this Congress or anyone else would want to displace all the Navajos off of what they call their reservation today

We have lost a lot of land, but we must continue. We have the future in front of us.

Mr. Chairman, you stated that the best people to resolve this issue are both tribes, the Hopi and the Navajo. I can take your time, Mr. Chairman and members of this committee, and the time of the American public to tell you what hardships we have on the Hopi Reservation, what laws the Congress passed, not just the relocation law, but any legislation passed here will cause some hardship on the Hopi.

There are the difficulties of the cuts in the Federal programs. I can talk to you about hardships, but isn't that what we are elected for? Is it not what I as the Chairman have the duty to do, to be the speaker or convey the bad news as well as the good news?

I think if we take that spirit, then certainly a lot of our problems will be resolved.

Senator McCain, I believe, knows very well that the Hopi Tribe has attempted to recognize the hardships of Navajos awaiting relocation. People across the nation thought that July 6, 1986 would be a day of violence, that Federal troops would be needed, that the

Hopi Tribe would go out and pick up Navajo elders and displace them.

I stand proud today that that did not happen, because we look across and recognize that we are all human, that there are the civil rights of people.

In the last two years, the Hopi Tribe has not filed any kind of law suit in Federal court or any court. In fact, we have changed lawyers. In fact, we have asked our lawyers how many law suits we have today and if some of those law suits are duplicative.

I would rather spend the money we have today to send young Hopi to school. I believe that record stands today that we want to continue to go forward.

I would like to see Congress call upon the two tribes and say, don't come to us until you resolve the issue. On some of those issues, you may have to bring us together, but as long as one of us has an avenue to come here and change the law, the Navajos are going to take that opportunity. With that opportunity, they are not going to be very much committed. It is one thing to say in words what we are going to do—it may become political rhetoric—but it is another thing to go and actually do what we are supposed to be doing.

Senator McCain, you are to be complimented in your efforts for offering these amendments. We as the Hopi Tribe have supported the Federal Relocation Commission, because that is the only avenue that is open to us to utilize the lands that have been restored to us, a portion of our lands. It is unfortunate that we have gone to the Federal courts, because the courts have been the only avenue to recognize our rights.

I see these amendments as a way to expedite relocation, recognizing the rights of these people and their hardships. It is an avenue that will permit Hopis to enjoy the land restored to them and less of an expenditure of money. It is very difficult for us to not support that.

I have also comments on the legal services contract. I think it is a good idea to expedite this whole issue and that the attorneys of all parties involved recognize that we have a duty to see the completion of the relocation.

I must say here today, Mr. Chairman, that the Hopis' position is we are awaiting the people to be relocated, those that are physically living on the Hopi Partitioned Land. Earlier, someone asked about the numbers. We had 36 Hopis apply for relocation. Of those, 24 were certified, 14 have moved, 10 are waiting to move, and 12 have been denied. Part of the 12 we assisted their denial by having them qualify for the HUD projects on the reservation.

On reports to Congress, I would like to offer that it may be a good idea that instead of the commissioner alone reporting to Congress, both tribes should report to Congress on where we stand and what our status is. If I am in some way impeding the law from being carried out, the Hopi Tribe should be notified as to how we can assist and complement one another. I feel it would be very important that both tribes report to you as well as the commissioner.

Again, the law calls for infrastructure—roads, water, schools, economic development, job opportunities. That is fine. I stand on the position, however, that it is our responsibility.

I was honored to be in the same city and the same room three weeks ago signing the renegotiated contract with Peabody Coal that would bring more revenue to both the Navajo and the Hopi for the coal that we own jointly as a result of this land dispute. In signing that, I feel confident that will be used for such matters as well.

Hopis who are to be relocated have all been relocated. With that experience, I find that no one here in Congress or anywhere else can assist the Hopi people better than the Hopi people themselves.

I feel I have not seen that from the Navajo Tribe during my 6 years as chairman. I have seen tremendous effort for the Navajo administration's position that they are totally against relocation. However, I find Navajos who are willing to move. I meet with them. I visit them. I talk to them. In some cases, we have improved the life styles of Navajos while awaiting relocation.

I had 12 Navajo elderly women in my office last year in August. They were in my office asking me why they could not get water from a windmill. This windmill was erected three years ago out of restoration monies for Hopi Partitioned Lands. They could not get water there because the windmill head was gone.

Upon my inquiry, I responded to them that the reason the windmill was not working was because it was subject to vandalism. We could not continue to repair the windmill, and I said to them that if you assist us, tomorrow we would have the windmill in place. And that happened. We have not heard about any vandalism of that windmill to date.

That is what I mean by assistance, how we can talk to one another.

In the Bennett freeze area, I am prepared today if that hospital needs that airport, Chairman MacDonald, I am willing to say I am in agreement. Let's do it. If they are talking about moving it somewhere else, then I question what the real intent of the purpose of that is, because any improvements put more of the justification on the claim for the party that is making the improvement.

Chairman MacDonald, 2 weeks after you were elected in November last year, I recall your comments in Colorado at that time that we are going to court. I took that to mean I will see you in court.

Well, let's expedite that. The quicker we go to court, the better able we will be to let life continue for both tribes.

Earlier, Senator DeConcini asked a question about movement of Navajos to the Tuba City area. I have questions on that, again, simply because the 1934 issue is not resolved.

Senator McCain, again, for the record, we are very much in support of improving the existing airport to make it safe to assist the hospital. It was very unfortunate that we lost Vice Chairman Stanley Honanie 1 week ago. He was at that hospital. So, it brings it home to us when we need the improvements.

If these amendments are going to be done for other purposes, then the Moenkopi area people tell me that in the last several years, there has been an influx of Navajos moving to the Tuba City area, and a lot of them are coming from the eastern and the western part of New Mexico.

There are two ways that are protecting Moenkopi from being overrun by Navajos today. One is that both tribes have to agree on

any improvements. Secondly, there is the legal avenue, but if there is going to be this amendment, then it takes away our being able to hold on until that case is decided.

As far as the attorneys' fees are concerned, I believe that the Hopi Tribe has gone on record to look at our attorneys' fees and to try to expeditiously move forward. If the income and resources are the same as the Navajo Tribe, then I think I would agree with Chairman MacDonald, but we don't have the resources that he does. If we are to pay for our legal fees, if this land issue is to be continued throughout the next several years, the Hopi Tribe will become bankrupt.

I don't think that is the intent of Congress or your intent, Senator McCain, but it is something worth looking at. It is something to look at to expedite this issue so that you and I can be very proud of our State of Arizona in that it has so much to offer.

Chairman Inouye, I feel in some respects that, as a small tribe and a humble one, we have one advantage in being a neighbor to one of the largest tribes, the Navajo Nation. If we are able to resolve this issue, we can join with them in the many opportunities that lie ahead for Indian people.

In your words, we are all a minority, and we don't have the luxury of disagreeing among ourselves. It brings us home. There is so much to enjoy, but we have this case to prevent us from stepping together. We cannot say, because I have a small tribe, that my defense is on my small tribe or Chairman MacDonald says because his is the largest tribe.

If we are going to get issues resolved, we need to do it together, and I feel today that we can walk out of here as better people. Through both of your interests, Chairman MacDonald, can we agree here and now in front of the committee that we both agree that the existing airport at Tuba City will be improved? I am prepared to give that approval today, and if we do it today, that is an accomplishment. I hope we can go forward.

Mr. Chairman and Senator McCain, I am encouraged by your willingness to move forward. I was criticized by Hopi people when I began my talks with the Navajo chairmanship, but I feel right is right, and right is going to prevail, and it is going to do it with people like yourself and the chairman of this committee. We must go forward.

Thank you for inviting us to offer our remarks. Mr. Chairman, my remarks are very preliminary. I was able to bring a few members of the Hopi Tribal Council with me. We can discuss it and will submit more statements for the record, but it is an opportune time to be encouraged that this avenue is to move forward. We certainly will enjoy that.

If we can come to an agreement on such an airport for Tuba City for the needs of the Navajo and Hopi, that is quite an accomplishment, and maybe we can enjoy the press that is here for the two nations which also came to some kind of an agreement.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

[Prepared statement of Mr. Sidney appears in the appendix.]

[Material to be supplied appears in the appendix.]

The Chairman. I thank you very much, Chairman Sidney.

When I opened the hearings this afternoon, I anticipated a long, drawn out, several decades' path toward a solution, but I amJfon~ vinced after hearing your testimony and that of Chairman tY~acDonald that the solution is within our grasp. For one thing, botn or you have been inundating my distinguished friend from Arizona with accolades and commendations. Ordinarily, I would pick up tne questioning at this point, but if the solution is in the McCain nana, I yield the floor to Senator McCain.

Senator Mccain. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you iur your kind remarks. .

I again echo the opinion of the two chairmen that your leaae ship on this issue and so many others is of the utmost importanc • We have great confidence that you will continue your commitment to this issue as well as so many others. ,

I would also like to congratulate both chairmen on very eloquent and compelling statements. Both of them, obviously, come from tne heart. Both of those statements come from years of experience ana years of suffering on behalf of the people of both their tribes, and both of them, I believe, display a commitment to try to resolve this issue which is very important and can possibly give us some room for optimism.

Chairman Sidney, would you let the Hopi people know of the sorrow that we all feel at the loss of your vice chairman, Mr. Honanie, who was of a very young age. I believe he was 42, and the loss of his leadership will certainly be felt.

Mr. Sidney. Yes; thank you.

Senator Mccain. I would like to, if I could, Mr. Chairman, do something a little unusual here since this is obviously a very unusual hearing and perhaps go a little further around the area that the chairmen were discussing concerning a possible resolution of this entire issue. I admit that I am treading on very dangerous ground here.

Both chairman, I know, are aware of the involvement back in 1985 of Mr. Richard Morris at the behest of Mr. Clark who had been appointed by President Reagan to try to seek a solution and some kind of agreement on this whole issue. I believe that both of you are familiar with the memorandum that was submitted in September of 1985 from Richard Morris to William P. Clark concerning the issue.

I thought it was as succinct and clear a description of the problems as they exist as any that I have ever read, and let me just quote to you one paragraph that I thought pretty well summed it up. Mr. Clark said:

We stated earlier that our mission was to determine whether an agreement could be effected between the tribes, and we noted that an agreement would not be possible should either tribe deem it not to be in its best interest to negotiate with the other. We also noted that there were but two bases for negotiations designed to relieve the burden of relocation: land exchanges and permissible living arrangements for Navajo on Hopi lands.

Are you in agreement, both of you, that perhaps that is basically the two bases for negotiations as they might exist, one is land exchanges and the other might be permissible living arrangements for Navajos on Hopi lands as opposed to the alternative that we are