Question. Have you been in North Carolina?

Answer. No, sir, I have not been there, but there has been men from there down here. Question. Did you recognize each other as members of this organization?

Answer. Yes, sir, There was an excitement got up here about the negroes onco as having rows-a good many rows were raised about the time, and the negroes had assembled together in bands at night, and the report had got out that they were going to burn the town; and I think one day there were perhaps forty or fifty men down here from North Carolina and the upper edge of South Carolina. I met men from Gaston, North Carolina, who gave me the sign of recognition.

Question. When was that?

Answer. Just before the soldiers came.

Question. Had you any talk with them about the order?

Answer. No, sir, we never had much to do with them. We just met and took a drink and would go ahead. We never discussed this subject on the street at all.

Question. Was ever anything said about what purpose was finally to be accomplished by this order?

Answer. I think, sir, it is a political thing.

Question. What was said on that subject?

Answer. There has never been anything general, nothing said positively about it; but I think the whole and sole object was to frighten.

Question. To frighten whom?

Answer. To frighten the colored people into a kind of obedience to them, so that they could be subverted to the interests of the democratic party.

Question. Was this ever said in your secret meetings?

Answer. As I told you, I was never in any secret meetings; but that was the general report made by the boys all around. They would say, "Next election we'll be certain to gain it, for the negroes know their own interests, and will not vote against us." That was the general talk among the democratic party.

Question. Of all these men you have named as in the organization, was any of them republican?

Answer. There was one man taken in by coercion.

Question. Who was he?

Answer. I think he was taken in simply by fraud. He had always been a republican up to the time he was initiated.

Question. Who was he?

Answer. Roland Williams. He was initiated, but I think it was done by his being frightened into it.

Question. Were you there when he was taken in ?

Answer. I was not present at his initiation. He was initiated down at the shop. Question. How did you get that information?

Answer. By John McLain and Rufe McLain. John McLain didn't belong to the party at all. He says, " Bill, what's going on up-stairs?" I said, "I don't know," but I had a suspicion there was an initiation going on, and next day I asked Rufe, "Was anybody put through last night ?" He said, "Yes, we put Roland Williams through." But he was a republican up to that time, but he worked on the lot, and had a suspicion that every one that worked on the lot belonged to it, and I suppose he joined to be with the party.

Question. Is there any understanding in that order that binds its members to deny their membership?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. To what extent are they bound to deny it?

Answer. You are bound to deny it under penalty of death.

Question. Suppose they become. witnesses in court?

Answer. They do it, then, at the penalty of life. Of course it wouldn't be profitable or safe. It is not profitable for me now." I am in danger every night of my life, and every day too.

Question. For what reason?

•Answer. Just simply because they think or have heard that I made these reports; and I told them at the time, and repeatedly, that if I was ever called on to state the truth about this thing I would do it, and, if called up, I would publicly denounce it in the court-house. I am no laggard about what I say. I don't fear anything to-day. Question. Suppose a member of that organization is called as a witness for the organization to defend it, how far does his obligation go?

Answer. He is bound to do all he can. Suppose a case was got up-a murder case. I belonged to the party. Well, if they were to arrest a man, and he was charged with this murder, and I was to be called on as a witness to prove that he was with me that night, although I had not seen him at all, I would have to go and swear that he was there that night with me; that's the plan of operations. Several cases have been got up here on suspicion of Ku-Klux Klanism, but they are always proved out, because

they can produce abundant proof; that is the principle of the party. They are bound to clear each other at the risk of their lives.

Question. Is that the instruction that is given to the members?

Answer. Yes, sir, you are bound to defend a brother.

Question. Who gives that instruction?

Answer. It is generally known by one another. You say such and such a man is up, and if we are called upon, we must do all we can.

Question. Were you given to understand that that was the meaning of the oath you took to defend each other?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. What case do you refer to in which there has been a trial, and they were called on to prove that the accused parties were in some other place?

Answer. Dave Barrett had a man arrested on a charge of Ku-Klucking him, or scaring him, or frightening him, or something, and swore to him. The man then turned around, and proved that he was eighteen or twenty miles off from the place of operations. Question. Who was that man?

Answer. I do not know. I just heard the case was going on at the court-house; I was down at the shop. We heard the Ku Klux had been tried and had proved that. Question. Was that for whipping Barrett?

Answer. I believe it was for getting after his son-in-law.

Question. Was Barrett the man that instituted the prosecution ?

Answer. Yes, sir, I think so. You mustn't expect to find me a perfect dictionary about all these matters, because it is not possible for me to know every little particular; but I give you my knowledge as far as it goes.

Question. Was this subject ever talked over in your Klan about how far witnesses were required to go?

Answer. Of course, that was discussed frequently. We were obliged to do anything and everything.

Question. How does it affect the obligation of a juror, if he goes on a jury to try a member?

Answer. He has to do all he can for the prisoner; it makes no difference what capacity he is in, he is bound to do all he can for him.

Question. How long has this organization existed in this State, according to your information?

Answer. I think since 1867.

Question. What is the use they make of this term Ku-Klux?

Answer. I don't know exactly the origination of that word. I don't understand the meaning of the word, in fact. There is something mysterious in it.

Question. What is the real name of the organization?

Answer. The real name of the organization is the Invisible Circle.

Question. Do you understand that it has the same name here that it has in other States ?

Answer. I think so. I think it is a general thing.

Question. Has the name been changed at any time?

Answer. If it has, I was not made aware of it.

Question. Had you any conversation with these North Carolina men about any change of sigus or words?

Answer. No, sir.

Question. You had no conversation about it?

Answer. No, sir, none at all.

Question. How many cases do you know of men being killed in this county?

Answer. What I have told you, are the only ones I know of.

Question. Have you heard of others?

Answer. No, I don't think I have. There has been others. I heard of a negro being shot out here in the leg, one day, out in the county a piece. He was hauling wood for Dr. Bratton; but it's all over town; that was done in daylight.

Question. Have any of these men in town said anything to you on the subject of your testifying here ?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Who?

Answer. I have been spoken to by Bloodworth, and Wallace, that lives up here in the country. He says it's reported in the country that I had received a certain amount of money, &c., and transportation iuto Canada, &c.

Question. What Wallace?

Answer. His name is Ran. Wallace.

Question. Has any one ever endeavored to deter you from testifying-anybody else than Bloodworth and Wallace?

Answer. That is all that have spoken to me on the subject; but it has been generally reported around.

Question. Did they do anything to prevent your testifying?

Answer. Yes, sir; they told me I had better not, if I had any intention of doing it. I have thrown them off their guard; I have given them no satisfaction. It would not have done at all for it to have become known that I would have done anything that I would tell.

Question. Why not?

Answer. Simply because they would have went for me. I would have been put up I would have been killed. Death would have been my portion.. That's the inference.

By Mr. STEVENSON :

Question. Do you say no names were used?

Answer. No, sir; we went by numbers.

Question. How were the numbers used?

Answer. The party that would go on business like that was arranged, and each clan numbered from one down to ten.

Question. You mean the members of each clan numbered?

Answer. Yes, sir. Sometimes they would change the numbers and take from ten on up. Sometimes we might call a man five or fifty, or one hundred and eight, or something like that-anything, so it was not his real name.

Question. What number was given to you?

Answer. Number fourteen. A man was called just any number; it didn't make any difference what it was, so it was not a name. A person was not to use any name at all.

Question. Where did you get your disguises?

Answer. My disguise I got at the shop-it was just a piece of oil-cloth-at the shop I worked at. No one knew anything about that. We always could get oil-cloth or anything there when we pleased.

Question. A carriage-shop?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Who commanded the town-clan on the night of the raid on the treasurer's office?

Answer. I think Tomlinson had control.

Question. How do you know he commanded it that night?

Answer. I know him by his number.

Question. But when he gives a command how do you know it comes from him?

Answer. Well, he was always with us, close to us.

Question. Is he dressed differently, or has he anything about him to indicate his command?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. To distinguish him on sight?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. What was it?

Answer. His dress that night? He was dressed in red flannel, I think, with white stripes all over him; in disguise.. I couldn't tell you exactly.

Question. When you moved did you march?

Answer. We just marched right along in file; single file sometimes, and some

times in double file.

Question. In military order?

Answer. Sometimes, and sometimes at a route-step, at the discretion of the party. Question. Where does your officer stand toward you when you move?

Answer. He goes ahead.

Question. How long was Porter held that night ?

Answer. I think it must have been an hour and a half or two hours. He was held until the party broke up. I think we were about an hour and a half or two hours in the place. He was not held exactly until the party broke up, but he was let loose up here just opposite Rawlinson's Hotel, in the back lot where the blacksmith's shop is. The party was broken up across the street.

Question. Is there any sign by which one member gives warning or caution to another?

Answer. None, only the signal whistle,

Question. What is that?

Answer. That is only employed at night.

Question. What is that?

Answer. It is a small whistle. You have seen them. They have a small ball in them to make a rattle. Three blasts are warning, and four is to call for aid.

Question. That is what is called a bead-whistle?

Answer. I suppose so.

Question. Is there any signal by taps?

Answer. Yes.

Question. What is that?

Answer. If you are on the street of a night and see a man standing about, and you are not close to him, if you give the three taps in that way, [illustrating,] if he belongs to the party he will respond.

Question. It is three taps-first one, and after that a little two together?
Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Is that used as a caution in any way?

Answer. Sometimes it is used as a caution, and sometimes as a signal.
Question. How as a caution?

Answer. It is always known if there is danger around. If you come up to a crowd of men and see a man in it talking too much, and about to divulge something, you can make the sound with your foot on the ground, the same as the taps. It wouldn't be noticed by the others, unless they belonged to the party. He would understand the meaning of it to be careful of the crowd, and so on. Perhaps he might not know the crowd he was in, and they might be trying to pick something out of him; that's to warn him.

Question. Do you know the two constables in this town?

Answer. The two police?

Question. Yes, sir. What are their names?

Answer. One of them is Rufus McLain, and the other William Snyder.

Question. Do you know whether either of them belongs to this organization?

Answer. Yes, sir; they both belong to it.

Question. Rufus McLain is the man you have already spoken of?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. I do not know whether you have named Snyder or not?

Answer. I have not.

Question. Do you say he belongs to it?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Which one of them was it shot a man the other night, since this committee came?

Question. How do you know he shot him?

Answer. I heard it next morning from two or three men on the street speaking about the shooting fray. They said William Suyder put five balls into a negro. They spoke down on the piazza about it, and I heard William say so himself.

Question. Who is the intendant of this place?
Answer. I think it is Frank Harris-F. C. Harris.

Question. Do you know whether he is a member?

Answer. Yes, sir, he is a member.

Question. Who appoints these policemen?

Answer. The council; the town council.

Question. Do you know who they are?

Answer. The town council are Mr. Hobbs and Harris, and Captain Kerr and -. I believe that is all. I believe there are four. I don't remember the other.

Question. Are any of them members?

Answer. I don't know any of them that are except Harris. I never have known by any sign, or word, or deed, that they belonged to it.

Question. Do you know Major Berry?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. What is his first name?

Answer. James Berry.

Question. Do you know whether he is a member of the order?

Answer. I don't know whether he belongs to it or not.

Question. Did you hear of the raids made on the jail at Unionville?

Answer. Yes, sir; that was in the paper.

Question. Did you hear of it before it happened?

Answer. No, sir.

Question. How soon afterward?

Answer. I didn't hear of it until the paper came out. I heard nothing in regard to it before that.

Question. Do you know whether any of the Klan went from this county or not?
Answer. I don't know; I don't think any one from town here.

Question. This county does not adjoin Union, does it?

Answer. It is right next to Union County. Broad River divides them.

Question. You do not know of any going from this county?

Answer. No, sir, I do not.

Question. Did you hear of the raid into Chester?

Answer. At the time they had that fight going on there?

Question. Yes, sir.

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Do you know whether any of the Klan from this county were in that? Answer. I don't know whether they were or not. I was working at the shop at the time, and had no chance to know.

Question. Do you know whether anybody went from here at that time? Answer. I really couldn't say, because I don't know; there might have been. Question. Have you heard among this Klan anything said as to where else the organization exists, in what other States?

Answer. I believe it extends all over the Southern States. I am not positively cortain of it, because I have not had a chance to get any information in regard to it. I think so.

Question. Did you get your information from members of the Klan?

Answer. Yes, sir; just speaking, talking.

Question. What do you understand to be the object of the Klan generally in all the Southern States?

Answer. It is a political thing, I think.

Question. How political?

Answer. I think the real intention at first was an opposition to this Union League business, and I do not think there would have been any Ku Klux if there had been no Union League. Then after a while it turned into simply a party business, I think. It was done to intimidate and frighten the negroes into obedien e to the wishes of the democratic party. I don't say that because I know it; I think it. Question. How do you get that information?

Answer. By the talk which is used in the party as regards elections, &c: You know in every-day conversation certain things are talked about and certain reasons are started why such a thing could be or not; that such a man will be elected next election. Why? Because the reason he was beaten the last time was certain negroes voted a radical ticket, and they'll not do it next time, because they are afraid of the Ku-Klux and they will vote for these other men.

By the CHAIRMAN:

Question. Have you any knowledge of an arrangement about taking up the rails on the railroad on the Sunday night before this raid was made on the treasury?

Answer. No, sir; fhad no knowledge of it until I learned it next morning afterwards. Question. What did you learn about it then?

Answer. I learned it was taken up to prevent the troops from going up that night. Question. Who arranged it?

Answer. I don't know who arranged it. I know some of the men who were there. Question. Who?

Answer. Cal. Parish up here was there.

Question. Who else?

Answer. Thomas, the engineer on the road.

Question. The engineer who runs on the road?
Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Who else?

Answer. John Benfield was there. That's all I know.

Question. How did you learn they were there?

Answer. I learned it next morning from Benfield.

Question. Did he tell you himself he had been there?
Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. What time did he say they had taken them up?

Answer. I think it was about 12 or 1 o'clock at night.

Question. Did he say with what purpose they had taken them up?

Answer. He didn't exactly express himself, but it was to prevent the soldiers from coming up here, I think, at the time. I think he knew of the intended raid on this place.

Answer. Right now?

Question. Yes.

Answer. I am employed in giving in evidence, I suppose.

Question. You know what I mean. Is that the sharp way you intend to answer my questions?

Answer. You asked me what I am doing. I am simply answering questions put to me. Question. Is that the way you intend to answer?

Answer. I don't know any other way.

Question. Do you not know that I meant what business are you engaged at in town just now outside of being a witness ?

Answer. Nothing at all, ouly my work.