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riot case when this thing commenced. A man named Johnson, who belonged to the white party, and a white man, one of the State constabulary, who belonged to the negro party-I do not know his name-got into a row. I understood that it started from a private matter entirely. Johnson had heard that this constable had denounced him as a tallow-faced son-of-a-bitch, and he called upon him to know whether he had said This fellow denied it, and acted pretty boldly for a man under his circumstances. He asked who had told him so. Johnson said somebody, and he said he was a damned liar-so I understood-and conducted himself with a good deal of manhood, surrounded as he supposed himself, because at that time there were a good many standing around. Anyhow, while they were quarreling, a pistol went off. It was said it either fell from the breast of somebody and went off, or went off in a man's bosom. Nobody was shot or shot at. Nobody ever claimed to have been shot at. That attracted attention. The negroes, seeing this difficulty, and one of their party engaged, began to crowd up in one direction, and the citizens crowded up in another direction, precisely as a quarrel will do on any public day, even when people are not aroused by party feeling. Those two men finally got to blows. It occurred on the pavement about fifty yards from this armory of Crews, a place where the constabulary always staid, and the negroes always congregated when they came to town. The fight commenced, and the constable gave back in the fight towards this armory, and got to the door and rushed into it. In the mean time the negroes, some of them, had gone in ahead of him. When he rushed in the door was slammed to, as I have understood, and just as he got in the firing commenced from that building. A volley was discharged from an upper window and they fired through the plank. The house was weather-boarded but not ceiled inside. The firing came out through the planking, balls. The holes are there now, showing that some balls came through from the inner side. I remember Judge Moses and myself walked by there at the last court. I never had examined it; he pointed it out, and said those balls came from the inner side certainly. When that firing took place from the house the firing was upon the people of the square just in front of it, but nobody was hurt. One ball hit the court-house, and one passed through the crowd but missed everybody-I do not know how; it passed over their heads and hit Mr. Sullivan's office across the public square, a lawyer's office. The people rushed upon that concern with their pistols and they ran in. They broke the door down, and the negroes gave back and ran out of the back door. About that time, as I said, I was in the court-house. I heard considerable noise in the public square-all of us did. A constable ran out to see what was the matter. When he came back I asked him what was the matter. He said the negroes had commenced firing upon the whites. That emptied the court-house instantly; but there was very little shooting after I got there. I did not see anybody shot. The negroes had gone from this building, and the firing was about over. It was a very short thing. Two negroes were killed right there, and I think one wounded.. Well, the people collected in bodies, all that were there nearly, and stood awaiting developments. It was supposed at first that the negroes who ran out of that building had started up to the other armory; but it turned out that they did not start there. During the evening Judge Vernon-who had adjourned court instantly, for everybody left, two or three negroes were on the jury, and they ran, and the court could not have gone on anyway-ordered the sheriff to raise a posse of one hundred men and take charge of these public arms. He did do so, and went up to Crews's house and hauled down all the arms from that place and from the other place, except those taken out by men who ran in, and he put them in the sheriff's office. It spread over the country worse than a prairie fire that the fight had commenced at the village between the whites and negroes; that the whites were in a minority and the negroes were getting the advantage; and they commenced coming in towards 5 o'clock in twos, threes, and tens on horseback.

Question. The white people?

Answer. Yes, sir; they came from every direction, and, I suppose, by midnight there must have been twenty-five hundred men. The news spread clear to Spartanburgh County that we had regular war down there; but, as I said, after the negroes ran out of there it soon quieted as far as the village was concerned. The negroes ran away and the constabulary ran away. As to Joe Crews, somebody had seen him in the morning, but he had run away. They all disappeared. There was a man in the constabulary from Napoleon, in your State, (Ohio,) named Volney Powell. Question. Governor Scott's place?

Answer. Yes, sir. He had been there a short time. He was a candidate for probate judge. There was a negro, named Bill Riley, a prominent fellow in his party, who was a sort of custodian of these guns, and another negro named Wade Perrin, who was a candidate for the legislature there. He harangued the negroes in the style of Crews, about the white people putting them in slavery, it seemed with a view of consolidating them against the whites, to make them believe that if the whites elected officers they would be put back in slavery, and to sow seeds of bitterness in their minds towards us. He was one of that class. Next morning the news came that Volney Powell and Bill Riley were found dead on the public highway, about four miles below

the village, shot in several places. I think they had arms then. They were found lying with guns by them-a gun apiece. It was so reported in the paper. I did not see it myself. This fellow, Wade Perrin, was found about fifteen miles below the village, on the public highway towards Newberry-found dead; and two other negroes in another part of the district, some six or seven miles from the village, were found dead next morning. That was the extent of the killing that I know anything about. There were two negroes wounded that day when these two negroes spoken of as first killed in the fight were killed. One white man was wounded that I know of in the fight. Question. Where?

Answer. In the fight on the public square. The ball hit him in the face, slightly wounding him. A little boy in a house was hit by a spent ball-a white boy. The ball went in at the window. Who it was shot by, I cannot tell. The negroes became very much alarmed, of course, and disappeared for a day or two. All these constabulary disappeared; Crews disappeared; but everything was quiet next day. None of this party has ever returned-neither the constabulary, Crews, nor any connected with him; not any of these leading men.

Question. Where does Crews keep himself?

Answer. In Columbia.

Question. What was the character of this man Crews we hear so much of; a quiet citizen or a disturber of the people'

Answer. Before the war he was a sort of merchant there. Some time before the war he failed in merchandise and became a negro-trader. There was no harm in him then, I suppose, so far as being a disturber of the peace was concerned. He was a quiet man in that respect. He was regarded as rather unscrupulous in pecuniary matters, and left a good many debts unpaid; but immediately after the war he became connected with the negro element. He claimed to be a republican, joined that party, and his purposes during every canvass we had seemed to be to instill hostility into the negro race towards the whites, and make them hate the whites. I suppose it was because he thought that one means of keeping them consolidated. He knew they were in a majority, and if they could be kept consolidated they could out-vote the whites and he could be elected.

Question. Did you ever see this publication of the card of those gentlemen who heard Crews's speech at Waterloo?

Answer. Yes, sir; shortly after this thing occurred the military was sent up there, and finally a regiment of troops-at least a brigadier general came out. He came all the way from Nashville, Tennessee-came under steam, rapidly. They seemed to be very much surprised when they got there. When they got to Newberry there was no railroad to our town. They were very cautious, expecting that they were to be attacked or ambushed, and came to town and found everything perfectly quiet. General Carlin, who was in command, told some of our oldest citizens that he was astonished to see our people so quiet. He had been impressed with the belief that they were a band of outlaws there, and would not allow any process to be executed. He came with considerable force, with a United States deputy marshal, and arrested about eleven of our citizens, among them the sheriff, and took them to Columbia, and lodged them in the jail, and we found great difficulty-I was employed as one of the counsel to defend them-we found great difficulty in having the writ of habeas corpus executed. Every obstacle was thrown in the way by the legislature, to the extent of vacating Judge Vernon's seat while he was hearing the case. While we were in that condition, our people, supposing from the fact that General Carlin had been sent all the way from Nashville, Tennessee, with all this military-we came to the conclusion that very exaggerated accounts of the difficulty, and the condition of the people of Laurens, had gone to Washington; and we held a public meeting and appointed a committee to go to Washington and make a statement to the President. I was chairman of the committee, which consisted of myself, Major Leland, and Robert Gojines. We went to Washington and made a statement to the President. We were introduced to him by Senator Robertson, of South Carolina. We made a statement of the affair there to the President-pretty much the same statement I make to you. I made it in writing, and in that was a copy of this speech-I cut it from the Herald-this certificate of these gentlemen near Waterloo of this harangue of Crews. The President heard us very patiently, and after we got through the papers were lying on his table. He said he had no power in the premises, but said that a committee had been just appointed-or would be, had been, I think-on southern outrages; and that he supposed that would be a proper paper for that committee, and he would send it for that purpose. That is the only copy I ever saw of that speech; it was in those papers. I thought while I was there that possibly it would be proper to make an application to go before the committee, and I made some inquiry, and heard that your committee was on North Carolina, and probably you would not change your line of investigation about a matter of that sort, and I made no application. However, one of the committee, Mr. Gojines, told me he had some conversation with you, Mr. Chairman; do you recollect it? The CHAIRMAN. I do not. It is very probable, however.

By Mr. VAN TRUMP:

Question. That is all you know of that affair?

Answer. That is all the history.

Question. How has that county been since ?

Answer. Entirely peaceable.

Question. Have you any military now?

Answer. No, sir; we had some military once since for a short while. I think there is a better feeling between the blacks and whites than before since the war. Question. Have those negroes been disarmed?

Answer. Entirely disarmed. They were disarmed on that occasion; the whites disarmed them. Shortly after that, Governor Scott sent General Anderson of his staff up there, and he had an interview with the people. We appointed a committee to wait on Governor Scott, and they explained and had a general understanding, and proposed to have the guns withdrawn; and the military came up under his direction and undertook to get the guns. Several of us published a card calling upon the citizens who had gotten guns upon that occasion to return them.

Question. Were any returned?

Answer. Yes, sir, I do not know; I believe more than two hundred were returned. We never could get the balance back; they went all over the country to the surrounding counties.

Question. Has it been ascertained how many were lost?

Answer. I never ascertained. I think at least a thousand guns were found, though. Question. I see by the adjutant general's report that Joseph Crews received six hundred and twenty guns himself?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Also ten thousand rounds of fixed-ammunition?

Answer. They were most splendidly equipped with all the equipments-belts, cartridge-boxes, and everything of the sort as nice as you ever saw.

Question. Have the negroes drilled at all since that?

Answer. No, sir; they did not drill then. I never heard of their drilling. They may have drilled sometimes in the night.

Question. I have had an impression that they drilled the day before the election; is that so?

Answer. I never heard of it. I never heard of their going out regularly for muster and drill; they never had a field that I ever heard of. The impression on the public mind there was that the whole thing was an electioneering scheme on the part of those leading that party in that county, and that these military companies were organized to consolidate the negroes. The Union League operated finely during the canvass of 1866, but the Union League had been broken down to some extent before the election of 1870. In 1868 the Union League held them just as close as possible, but a good many had wandered away from it, got tired of it.

Question. Was Joseph Crews connected with the Union League?

Answer. Yes, sir; he was the president or prominent man in it.

Question. Was he the only one?

Answer. There was one other scalawag in our county by the name of Owens. He was elected senator. He and Crews were the only two men in the county that ever took any prominent part in combining the negroes in this way.

Question. Although you say you do not remember the special provisions of the militia law, yet do you recollect enough of it to know and say that an honest administration of it would have been a registry of all the people, white and black, and the organization of all, white and black?

Answer. That is my construction of the act, and I am satisfied if you have the act here you would give it the same construction.

Question. And the fact is that there was no public registry?

Answer. No, sir.

Question. No public organization?

Answer. No, sir; no public announcement.

Question. Yet the fact is that there were organized four or five companies in your county?

Answer. Yes, sir.

• Question. And arms for four or five or six hundred sent there?

Answer. Yes, sir. Whether Governor Scott did or not mean so, but he must have known it. Those companies were organized, as far as the white people had any notice, in the night-time. We never heard of their organization until they were out in the street on public occasions.

Question. Was there any attempt to organize the whites themselves?

Answer. Yes, sir; when it was ascertained that these negro companies had been organized.

Question. But under the State law?

Answer. I was going to tell you. We supposed it was a voluntary arrangement;

but there was nothing in the law allowing volunteer companies. We supposed Governor Scott, by some power, could accept volunteers. One or two companies of whites were organized in the day-time, and Governor Scott was written to to accept them, and he declined to accept them.

Question. Did he give any reason?

Answer. No, sir.

Question. How many companies of that sort were there in your county?

Answer. I know of two, certainly. Colonel Bull, here, whom you have subpoenaed, was captain of one of them himself, and he had some correspondence with the adjutant general's office about accepting them; but it went no further, after the department declined to accept them. They never appeared again as an organization of the militia.

Question. Has there been any lawlessness or violence by the Ku-Klux organization in your county?

Answer. No, sir; we have no Ku-Klux. I feel perfectly sure that there has not been a disguised band of men in Laurens County during the whole of this excitement. If so, I have never heard of it.

Question. You do not know of any murders or whippings of negroes by that organization in your county?

Answer. No, sir, not one. I saw in "The Union," a week or two ago, that a negro had been whipped, or shot probably, but not killed, near Clinton, some time ago-but I never heard it there-by one or two disguised men. But I never heard of it, and I do not believe it. This is the only act of violence that has occurred since 1868. A week or two before the election of 1868, when Blair and Seymour were the candidates, we had a torchlight procession, or something of the sort, in the village, which attracted many people. In going home, three young men, three miles from the village, were fired upon in the highway within a hundred yards of the house of Mr. Shell, and one of them killed dead; shot from his horse, a young doctor-a fine fellow, and an upright man; the other was slightly wounded. That was supposed to be by negroes. These men who were wounded saw them running off through the fields, but were not able to identify anybody. The place was examined the next day and there was an appearance of a good many having been there. That went on some time. Finally, one negro in the county made some statement to another negro as to his connection with it, and he reported it. The one to whom the statements were made reported it to the friends of young Shell and they made some arrangement by which a conversation could be brought about between these two negroes at another time, within the hearing of some respectable gentlemen, and this negro gave a statement of the fact that he was present and shot the gun that killed Shell himself. He was arrested, tried, and convicted. Question. These men in ambush heard it?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. How many were there?

Answer. Two.

Question. Did they attempt violence?

Answer. No, sir.

Question. What was done?

Answer. He was arrested, brought to jail, tried-counsel were appointed by the judge to defend him-upon the testimony of these two witnesses who heard it, and the negro to whom he had made this statement, and who induced the conversation that was heard by these other two gentlemen. He was convicted of murder and sentenced to be hung. He was pardoned, or rather his sentence was commuted by Governor Scott to the penitentiary; I think twenty years' imprisonment. He is in the penitentiary now, I have understood, and I have not heard of his coming home yet.

Question. As I have had no conversation with you, and do not know anything except this riot upon which to ask you, I will inquire, generally, have you anything else that discloses the condition of your county? If so, you can state it.

Answer. As I have mentioned the occurrence, it is fair to state that, before that occurrence, a negro man named Harry McDaniels, a member of the legislature, in his own house, ten miles above the village, was fired upon and wounded; by whom it was done is not known. He charged it upon whites, but there was no judicial investigation, and there is no telling who did it; I do not know. This comprises all the acts of violence I know anything of, or have heard anything of since 1867. Question. What were the politics of those three young men?

Answer. They were democrats. They were going home from a torchlight procession, and were suddenly fired upon. Dr. Shell, poor fellow, had just passed his father's house, where he staid, and rode up to the forks of the road, a hundred yards, to bid the young men good night, and separate from them and talk a little, and just as they got through, and were about to separate, this firing was made upon them. I do not know any other act of violence that I can now recall to mind during that time, except, recently, a man named Scott, a merchant about fifteen miles above the village, who was thought to have some money, went over to Abbeville, and left his family two or

three weeks ago. He left his wife and two or three little children, and at night some ten or fifteen persons came to his house, forced themselves in, and demanded the key of the money-drawer. She refused to tell anything about it, and the party— Question. Were the party black or white?

Answer. They were black. They were disguised. Three negroes were arrested. She is able to identify two of the three, I understand-she and her little son. She knew who they were. They committed a good deal of violence; pulled her about the floor, and shot over her. Her little son raised up in the bed, and called out to one of them, "Squire, what are you doing there?" and he caught him by the hair and dragged him about until he told where the key was, and they got the money and left. That was a pure act of robbery, and had nothing whatever to do with politics, black or white. Question. That has been in the newspapers, has it not?

Answer. Yes, sir.

By the CHAIRMAN:

Question. What was this difficulty in Newberry that originated a trouble which spread into your county?

Answer. I do not know how it started. All I heard of it was that there was a considerable body of whites and blacks on the eve of collision. It was arrested by the sheriff of Newberry taking the posse and going up and stopping it.

Question. You mean what spread into your county was a spirit of uneasiness, fearing a collision between the whites and blacks?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Without knowing the real origin in Newberry?

Answer. Yes, sir; it started there and extended the very next day, and that night came there.

Question. You say the month before four hundred negroes were in your town not armed, and there was no disturbance?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Their presence there gave rise to apprehensions throughout the country, and gentlemen were coming in from all quarters until you sent them word and they did not come?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Was there any organized system by which intelligence was conveyed to the people to come in in case of necessity?

Answer. I do not know that there was any regularly organized system. It was very easy, you know, in case of any danger, just to send word out. There was no combination in the village, no society that I ever heard of, organized with a view of being prepared to meet an attack.

Question. What is the character of the population of your county? Is it a dense population?

Answer. It is pretty densely populated.

Question. For your State?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. What is the population of the whole county?

Answer. I do not know; I suppose twenty thousand.

Question. They are engaged chiefly in agriculture?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. And they were coming in that same night that these four hundred men were in your place?

Answer. It was in the day-time; they were coming in before night.

Question. No difficulty then really occurred until the day after the election ?
Answer. No, sir.

Question. You say that on the day of the election the news again spread that the negroes were arming at Crews's house?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. And Colonel Smith, upon appealing to them, stopped it, and if they had arms they laid them down?

Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Was there any actual collison on the day of the election?

Answer. No, sir; Colonel Smith prevented it..

Question. Then you trace this difficulty on the day after the election entirely to the fact that the private quarrel was between Johnson, who, you say, belonged to the white man's party, and one of the constabulary?

Answer. Yes, sir. The public mind, growing out of this state of things, during the whole canvass, was, on both sides, just like a powder magazine, and any little thing was like to precipitate a conflict.

Question. When these two men were engaged in their conflict, a pistol went off? Answer. Yes, sir.

Question. Nobody could tell where it went off?

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