Mr. GUDE. Well, assume he lived closer to the Connecticut Avenue line, which I think would be the case for most residents of Columbia Heights.

Mr. MCCARTER. He would take the crosstown bus to the Connecticut Avenue station and then transfer to rail transit. Our study indicates that 80 percent of all the riders will use feeder buses.

In other words, rapid transit is high-capacity transportation and people must be brought to it by some other means of transportation. There are very few walk-ins.

Mr. GUDE. Maybe I have not made myself clear. Under the present law, he would get on a subway, the Columbia Road spur. Would he get a through train that would take him around to Silver Spring? Mr. MCCARTER. Yes. And there would be a train every 2 minutes under this bill, that would take him to Silver Spring.

Mr. GUDE. Under the present law?

Mr. MCCARTER. Under the present law

Mr. GUDE. He would get on a Columbia Road train, right?

Mr. MCCARTER. He would get on a train there (pointing to Connecticut Avenue), and it would go on around to Silver Spring, but it would not be every two minutes.

Mr. GUDE. He would go directly around to Silver Spring.

Mr. MCCARTER. That is right. And if he happened to live right on the Connecticut Avenue line or if he would walk to it, he would not have to transfer. The question is whether a $56 million feeder subway should be built to do the job of a feeder bus. In any rapid transit system at the residential end, 80 percent of the people use feeder buses. So if a large percent of riders use buses to get to this Columbia Heights line, they can easily stay on the bus to get over here to Connecticut Avenue. And you can see these lines (indicating cross town bus routes). Here is a bus line that comes down to the Dupont Circle station. Here is a bus line that comes across to Connecticut at the Woodley station.

Mr. GUDE. Well, he would have eight-minute service. But would every train that comes along the Columbia Road line, would it go out to Silver Spring? What about the Kenilworth-Benning line? Would he be guaranteed that every train that comes down that Columbia Road line would take him out to Silver Spring?

Mr. MCCARTER. Both systems propose a horseshoe type configuration from Connecticut to downtown and then up to Silver Spring. The Benning Road line would ultimately go on across to Virginia. If somebody wanted to transit from Benning Road to Silver Spring, it would require a transfer.

Mr. GUDE. All right. So then in eight mintues he could get a train. around to Silver Spring from Columbia Road?

Mr. MCCARTER. Yes; unless that service was so lightly loaded that it might not be justifiable-from an operation viewpoint-to take it all the way out to Silver Spring. It is possible although not probable for that train to turn into the yard at that point (alongside the B & O right-of-way) and then turn back. So it is possible that you could have a little shuttle service for that yard and big service all the way around.

Mr. GUDE. Yes. Well, suppose he had a comparable job over at D.C. Stadium. Would he get eight-minute service there also?

Mr. MCCARTER. There would be eight-minute service here at Columbia Road under the old plan.

Mr. GUDE. Yes.

Mr. MCCARTER. Under the plan in this bill, there would be fourminute service in the Bennings Road area. So he might in the extreme wait eight minutes at Columbia Heights and then wait four minutes at G Street for a train that goes over here (to the stadium.) Mr. GUDE. I see. So the transfer would be at that point?

Mr. MCCARTER. Yes.

Mr. GUDE. Generally, as far as other systems go, say in other cities as your experience in Chicago shows, what about headway time between trains? Is an eight-minute wait considered long?

Mr. MCCARTER. In Chicago we considered a six-minute wait as the maximum. So at certain times of the day and certain times of the evening we gave what you might call a policy service of six minutes, but never a longer interval than six minutes between trains. On all the Chicago lines it is only two minutes between trains in the rush hour. On the main north-south line it's four minutes during off-peak hours, and on the other lines it is six minutes. But Chicago does have the lines separated like this such as we propose here (exhibit B). In other words, there are three different through lines coming into downtown Chicago. They do not connect through junctions, or the two minute peak hour service could not be maintained throughout the system.

In other words, in Chicago you have the north-south line. You have the Lake Street line that comes in around the loop. You have the Douglas-Congress line that comes in through Dearborn Street and then on out northwest. But each line operates separately. Similarly, I propose two lines operating separately here in Washington. A third line or mid-city line which the authority is now studying would also operate separately providing 2 minute capacity. This would be a north-south line, perhaps along 7th or 14th street, and would provide excellent service for the north-central part of the city.

I have another chart here that might be helpful. Among the lines being studied by the Authority is one that starts out here at Greenbelt, Maryland, comes in partly on the B&O, than along route I-95, then down Seventh Street where it would contact both the lines of the basic system, first at 7th and G, and than at 7th and D. It would continue down through southern Anacostia, then over into Maryland to the Beltway. That would provide Washington with three efficient lines providing two-minute service like they do have in Chicago.

I have a study made by Voorhees, which shows that for all four stations of the Columbia Heights line, taking the four stations at the maximum there would be 3,200 riders boarding during the maximum hours and 800 getting off.

For the four stations on 7th Street, not including the Riggs Road transfer station and not including the transfer at G Street, there would be 9,800 people getting on and 4,000 people getting off. So it is obvious how much better a 7th Street line would be than a Columbia Heights line.

I have no power now to ask for a 7th Street line, but the Authority will probably want a mid-city line, and it would be unfortunate to foreclose that possibility by building the Columbia Heights lines.

Mr. GUDE. To get back to the Columbia Road line (see your Exhibit A), it would be desirable, when we have a system, that we have eight-minute service, but is that during the rush hour? Would they have eight-minute service 24 hours a day?

Mr. MCCARTER. No. Eight-minute service would be available only during rush hour when there is two-minute service on G Street. When off-peak service is reduced to four-minutes on G Street, the effect would be to cut Columbia Heights to 16-minute intervals.

Mr. GUDE. Suppose somebody was working an odd shift and had to catch a train in the afternoon, do you mean he could not catch a train every eight minutes?

Mr. MCCARTER. No. It would be every 16 minutes, at least.

Mr. GUDE. Every 16 minutes?

Mr. MCCARTER. Yes. However, with the modified system, off-peak service would be every four minutes on Connecticut Avenue. With proper bus feeders it would provide much better service than waiting 16 minutes.

Mr. GUDE. Well, Congressman Broyhill and I have been very concerned. We have businesses and employers out in our areas that are looking for workers, and we have been working with the Transportation Division of UPO here in Washington. We are even trying to work out some type of a shuttle bus system and seeing what we can do to alleviate the job shortage in the suburbs in addition to solving the transportation malaise in the downtown areas of Washington. And, of course, I am very sympathetic with Mr. Frain who has expressed the concern of the Columbia Heights Businessmen's Association in this regard.

In his statement he said that the Columbia Road Spur would serve 500,000 people in the center city. This, of course, concerns me.

Mr. MCCARTER. There probably are 500,000 people in the center city but one small line is not going to serve all of them. Our traffic study indicates maximum hour service on that line for 3,200 people, not 500,000.

Mr. GUDE. Are you suggesting that bus service over to the two main lines would be the way to give them the best service possible?

Mr. MCCARTER. Yes, the best service possible until a 7th or 14th. Street line is built. In my opinion, if we built a Columbia Heights. line, it would forever foreclose the building of a separate, maximum service line that should be there, the 7th or 14th Street line.

Mr. GUDE. What would happen to service to Prince Georges County if we kept the present plan? How would they go about serving that area? You suggested the 7th Street line would go out to Prince Georges County.

Mr. MCCARTER. First, I should explain that the Authority in planning a regional system has used the modified plan, rather than the authorized plan. I do not think they could build on the authorized system and get adequate service to the suburbs because the service on every extension would be governed by conditions along G Street. The basic system contains the Benning route which can curve across northern Anacostia and into Maryland. The 7th Street route would extend down past the Weapons Center, across southern Anacostia, and then out into Maryland. A third route for Prince Georges County