L. Yes, the law gives it them-the king is, by the law, supreme head of the church; and it is the king that executes the laws. An ecclesiastical establishment infers the necessity of ecclesiastical reve nues. C. I believe some of them claim a right more than merely legal. to us. L. I hope but few. They who do so belong to you, rather than If they be in earnest, they are enthusiasts, and to be pitied: if they be not in earnest, they are impostors; a worse character, and undeserving of pity. C. What your Lordship advances is true of heretics, who can claim no divine mission, and consequently no divine succession. L. They may claim both as well, and as much as Catholics do. Calling men heretics is only calling names, and shewing spite or folly. They are chiefly madmen or impostors, who scatter and apply such names. Perhaps there is not a man in the world, but who is a heretic to every other man. Thinking and imagination have no standard; they are as various as taste, features, and complexion. C. Then you reject the authority of the church to settle faith. L. If by the church you mean the clergy, I do intirely. With your church the most profane extravagancies pass for faith. What can be more so than the unsizeable monster of transubstantiation, which alone contains all impiety and imposture, all assurance and nonsense? C. I shall not enter into any discussion or defence of the profound mystery of transubstantiation. L. I would not have you it has been often, and lately, well exposed; but you must not renounce such gainful and flattering blasphemy, which sets you above God, and makes men your slaves, body and soul, by frightening them out of their senses, men that can make God, may well set up to rule in his stead; may well give away and direct both the upper and nether world, much more this little one that lies between themn. C. My Lord, this pierces me L. I doubt it does not change_you. C. My Lord, I own it does not. But surely, if God institutes priests, he gives them some power, power to be useful. L. He never gave you any power; and wherever you have it, you make it only useful to yourselves, and by it destroy many, and deceive all. All men have power to be useful to one another. C. Is your Lordship then against all priests? L. Against all that would enthral and deceive me. L. I mean that our own do not. C. My Lord, are they exempt from error? L. No man is; but if they deceive us, 'tis our own fault. They are of our own choice and establishment. We allow them no power, but that of persuasion and the law of the land. C. Do they not claim the power of making one another? L. We give them that power, as we suppose them best acquainted with one another. We even appoint and limit the manner of applying and exercising it. C. Is there not such a thing as absolution amongst you? L. Yes, the priest tells the people, what the word of God tells both him and them, and what any of us could tell them, if the law appointed us, "That God pardons and absolves sinners who truly repent." May not any Christian declare as much? C. It is a very singular absolution which heretics and laymen can pronounce. L. Of heretics I have spoke already. And as to laymen, why may they not (if appointed thereunto) read out of a book, what God has plainly written in his book, or what any other book takes out of God's book. C. Are not the clergy only so appointed? L. The law may appoint any man; it even declares what is Scripture; why not declare too, who is to read the Scripture, and to do all the duties of religion? C. This is discharging all clergymen at once. L. Why so? Whoever does the offices of religion, as the law appoints him, will be a clergyman in the eye and language of the law. The leaving you, the Romish clergy, to be masters in religion, has made you masters of mankind. C. So the law is to take care of your souls. L. It appoints us teachers, and leaves us the Bible to teach them and us too. We dread forcers of faith, and all who would punish us for not having theirs. C. O my Lord, consider what a relief absolution is to a doubting and despairing soul. L. Our absolution is sufficient, and the only one; any other is imposition and tyranny. Where God pardons, can you, dare you condemn? Where God condemns, can you, dare you punish? C. We know who are proper objects of his mercy, and who of bis wrath. L. What then? Can you obstruct his wrath or mercy from reaching such objects? C. We can labour to hasten his mercy, or to avert his wrath. L. So can I and every man labour; but neither you nor I can inform God, or help him by our instruction. To the submissive and liberal, be they ever such offenders, your absolution is ready; and you damn the most innocent, who refuses to obey and pay. What can be more impudent and profane? There are no such impious doings amongst Protestants. C. My Lord, pray consider L. I do, father; how tender you are upon this article ?—It is indeed of high moment to your craft, to be thought to carry the fate of human souls in your own hands, to damn and save men, and to manage your Maker; but, father, it is dreadful imposture and blasphemy; as your penalties and severities are dreadful cruelty. C. I do not wonder to find your Lordship, when you had gone so far, going still further, and declaring against church discipline too. L. Father, if by church discipline you mean punishment for errors (which are generally involuntary, else men would not suffer for them) I think it diabolical; and if there be a hell upon earth, it is your inquisition; a lying, bloody, fiery, torturing tribunal, set up to guard craft against conscience, and, under the cheating name of the holy office, fatal to all truth and religion. C. Perhaps in some countries it may be carried too far; I wish it were not. There are many Catholic countries where it never was, nor would be suffered. L. True, father, and you give the reason-No thanks to your religion and your priestsThe true Catholic spirit is for it every where. In England its treachery began to operate, and its fires to flame, under the Catholic queen Mary, a zealot for Popery, and a murdering dæmon to her Protestant subjects. These had set her upon the throne, and in requital she burned them. What think you, father, of her faith, pledged to heretics? C. They may have forfeited their right to it L. By being heretics. A fair confession! If you had not made it, we know your meaning. At least I do, who have conversed with you often upon the subject. C. Is the world to be over-run with heretics, without restraint or remedy? L. Can fire and sword remedy or restrain opinion? Or ought such remedies ever to be tried? Heretics may be good subjects to a state, as well as good Christians, and thence merit the protection of it. Have Catholics always been so ? C. Yes, to Catholic states. L. A good hint, father-But often not then. Have not Catholic priests frequently plagued, sometimes murdered Catholic princes? And were they not prompted to it by the heads of the Catholic church? C. Explanations may be offered L. To justify the church in her greatest foulness and enormities. You know she cannot err, and all her frauds and massacres are holy. C. My Lord, times and circumstances, and the insolence of heretics L. Sanctify what never can be defended-The butchery of heretics is a just sacrifice to the offended Catholic church--What do we deserve, father, we English heretics? C. I never heard an English Catholic wish you the least violence; they abhor it. L. I know the sensible lay Catholics do--But what if the Pope should decree our chastisement (I will not call it by the worst name) and you priests, sworn blindly to obey him, and warmed with your own zeal, should urge the damnation of disobeying the Pope ? C. My Lord, I cannot suppose any such thing. L. Father, I will not press you-I know you must either evade the "question, or give an insincere answer. For the same reason I shall not perplex you with questions about the government, and the present at tempts against it. Only I would beg you constantly to believe, that they will be blasted, and then you will be under no temptation to promote them. C. My Lord, I love peace and am in no plot. L. Persist there. Give me leave however to tell you what an unfortunate faith you hold. It flatters you with your own importance, even to blasphemy. For, not to meddle with the glaring, bold, and wonderful lie of infallibility (an incommunicable attribute of the om nipotent and omnipresent God, never to be found in frail men) can there be greater blasphemy than your doctrine of making your Maker, and that of disposing of heaven and hell, and the souls of men? C. Do not your clergy assert the real presence in the sacrament, aíter they have blessed the elements? L. They who mean more than the divine blessing and efficacy of that holy ordinance upon their souls are not Protestants.-Then, father, your anti-christian principles of punishing men for religious opinions, principles so destructive of religion and human society, make you dreadful, not to say odious, to all men who follow reason and the gospel. C. The Policy of the church was devised for the preservation of the church; which cannot be done without power, nor power be exerted without penalties. L. There is no such policy in the gospel, no church power, no civil penalties. C. It was found necessary L. Not by Christ, nor by his apostles. Was it not apostacy to relinquish and contradict their example ? C, Have not the Protestant clergy been for wholesome severities? L. No true Protestants-bigots and apostates, if you please and such, if there be any such remaining, the civil power curbs, as it should the ecclesiastics every where. They are too subject to zeal without knowledge. Our present clergy especially their chiefs, are famous for moderation. This is true Christian merit. Whatever be the cause, let them have their due praise. NUMBER 89. Continuation of a Dialogue between a Noble Convert and his late Confessor. C. My Lord, heretics must not pretend to L. As much as you do, and as reasonably to do mischief.- -Suppose they were to retaliate upon you, to entertain no charity; to keep no faith towards you, and to return your own wholsome severities upon you; to set up an inquisition, to imprison and torture, confiscate and burn Catholics, as Catholics do Protestants; and, in short, none of you were suffered to live unmolested amongst them,—with what face could you complain? C. They themselves own, that salvation is to be had in our church; we deny it to them. Is not this a proof that we are the only orthodox church? L. It is an evident proof of the contrary. That church which wants charity, wants Christianity. Whoever has most charity is the best Christian. Men had better be without religion, than savages for it. The most barbarous sects, Turks and Tartars, flatter themselves, and damn all others, in the same style. The most flaming enthusiasts, such as took madness for religion, have boldly claimed an exclusive heaven, and wantonly consigned all the rest of the world to hell. C. My Lord, we would punish and suppress all such enthusiasts. L. And do yourselves just what they do. This damning spirit is a sign that religion is perverted into faction, and that they who possess it would frighten men, in order to enslave them. It is a studied fraud, to acquire dominion and money, and a plain renouncing of the spirit of Christ. I wonder how a man, who finds himself possessed with such a spirit, can have peace of mind, or expect favour from God or man. But enthusiasts can reconcile contradictions. All uncharitableness tends to persecution; and 'tis high assurance in a man of a persecuting spi. rit, to offer to make converts. If ever any man could warrant persecution, the persecutor warrants it against himself. C. My Lord, I have said nothing to provoke you to all this bitterness against the Catholic church; I only alledged, that you Protestants gave it the preference to your own. L. No, we do not: we say that yours is a corrupt, idolatrous, and anti-christian church; but we are not bold enough to confine the mercies of God, which are infinite; and therefore allow his infinite mercies to extend even to uncharitable Papists, who are the more to be pitied for their cruel want of charity. So that, in allowing salvation to be had in your church, we make a compliment to our own by owning, that it abounds in charity. Father, I have been the longer upon this bead, because I know it to be your great bait to catch old women, children, and the rabble. Your argument is shocking to common sense. The more I think of you and your church, the gladder I am to have left you. Where has God said, that he will damn any man for not going to mass, or for dissenting from any religious mode, or any clerical institution? C. My Lord, must not the church be supported with proper sanctions and terrors? L. You support yours with dreadful ones indeed; but the church of Christ abhors all such. If you claim any such, he disclaims you.Dungeons, flames, and tortures, are no legacy from him; nor can there be a stronger proof that any church is not from God, than that she exercises any vengeance and fury in his name. There cannot be a higher insult upon the name of Christ, nor a greater affront to the reason of men, than the alledging a warrant from that holy, meek, and bumble name, for any sort of severity, much more for any cruelty, or even for any share of power or pride. C. What thinks your Lordship of the Jewish church? Did not the Almighty environ her with authority and penalties? L. Yes; but the civil magistrate had the application of them; and God always speaks to the priests by Moses, his representative. Father, how do you like the example? Besides, every ceremony, and the whole Jewish discipline, were precisely described and limited by God himself, and nothing left to the direction of the priests, not even their own garments, nor the utensils of sacrifice, nor the forms at the altar.→→ Can you shew any such authority for your endless grimaces, or for any of your pious tricks and postures? Did the wise God indite your motly mas? Did the God of mercy frame your inquisition, or command you Bb |