feeding upon sacrifices and offerings, preferred Bacchus and his grapes to the spirit of Christ.

Cler. The comparison you would insinuate is impudent and profane.

Qua. Friend, meekness becometh a preacher. Thou hast the passion of a priest, but not the meekness of a minister of the gospel. Why dost thou fall upon me with bitter words, for telling thee a fact which, in answer to thee, it was necessary to tell. Is it profane to say that the heathen clergy took offerings? Nay, since thou dost urge me, dost not thou take offerings? and did the apostles take any? I have put thee between these priests and the apostles, that by comparing thyself with both, thou may'st see whom thou resemblest most.

Cler. If this be not profaneness, I know not what is.
Qua. The profaneness is not on my side.

Cler. Let me inform you, sir, that for this language, in some countries, you would have your tongue cut out of your head.

Qua. I know it; and praise God that I am not in those countries, and that thou can'st not bring those countries hither. It is plain that thou approvest their barbarity, else why dost thou think it due to me? I beg thou wouldst not be provoked, if I mention to thee once more the example of the apostles: where did they justify savageness and severity to any man for any opinion, or any words? where did they ever talk to Pagans as thou dost to me, who am a Christian, and endeavour to possess the temper of the gospel?

Cler. Yes, you have a form of godliness: but

Qua. Friend, in the first place, judge not; and secondly, beware what thou sayest against forms, for thy own sake.

Cler. I say, if your preachers had power, they would quickly find texts for persecution.

Qua. I guess thou judgest by thyself; and thou judgest well. We know it; and therefore give them no power, nor the sinews of power. Pride and impatience are inseparable from it: it destroyeth all humility, and maketh men imperious, and persecutors. Why are the Popish priests more cruel and mischievous than Protestant priests, but because they have more power? And why is the pope the most mischievous of all priests, but because he hath most power?

Cler. You carry every thing too far. Preachers of the gospel ought to be kept above contempt.

Qua. Friend, they who are rich in spiritual things, want no other riches to save them from contempt; and they who are rich without these, ought to be contemned. Riches may render them formidable; but piety only, and a holy conversation, can make them reverenced. Revenues do not place them above contempt, but only encourage them to despise the people. The poverty of the apostles was great part their glory.

NUMBER 71.

Dialogue between a Country Clergyman and a Quaker, continued.

Cler. Of all people I think the Quakers have the least pretence to glory in their poverty.

Qua. Thou seemest in this to aim at being severe, but I feel it not. Our moderate wealth is the effect of our honest industry, and we are not ashamed of it.

Cler. As well you might, if you got it by your preaching.

Qua. I do not find that thou art ashamed, and yet thy income great this way.

Cler. Then you make comparisons?

Qua. Assuredly, no; thy motives and ours are not akin.
Cler. I warrant you preach by the Spirit.

Qua. How preachest thou? by the sheet?

Cler. I read my sermons, to avoid incoherences.

Qua. Thou needest not, hadst thou the Spirit it would help thy infirmities.

Cler. Does the Spirit help you to your low language, and your silly repetitions?

Qua. If repetitions are silly, why shuttest not thou thy CommonPrayer Book, which aboundeth therein? And as to your language, if the Spirit were a dealer in style, why doth Paul write such bad Greek, as the learned say? But I can tell thee, we have many men amongst us, who preach in as decent language, and as free from tautologies, as any that thou canst read out of thy note-book. I could mention the different efficacy too, and the manifest disinterestedness of our preachers;. but I spare thee.

Cler. Spare me! I fear you not,

Qua. Why, truly nor I thee, since thou defiest me. I have found thee no terrible adversary, which may not be the fault of the man. Thy bishop would not do better, though his pay is greater.

Cler. It is too true, he could not: reason is thrown away upon you, and such as you.

Qua. To deal freely with thee, as I am not the richer, so neither art thou the poorer, for any reason thou hast thrown away upon me. Cler. Where men pretend to the Spirit, it is in vain to argue with them.

Qua. Then why dost thou ? But especially why floutest thou the Spirit ?

Cler. I hope there is a wide difference between the Spirit of God and the spirit of enthusiasm.

Qua. Doubtless there is; but I would be glad to hear thee explain the difference.

Cler. The same difference as between a good understanding and a wild hot imagination.

Qua. Thy words sound well, but thy reasoning is naught. Is not the gospel above the best understanding? and was it not to the Greek

philosophers foolishness? They had as much sense as thou or thy bishop, and knew their own language better; but could not comprehend the incarnation and crucifixion of Christ the Lord, nor original sin and the resurrection. The light of the Spirit hath therefore no analogy with the natural understanding; as you yourselves contend, when you would confute or punish people for following their reason, and departing from your systems. I must tell thee too, that the Spirit warmeth both the heart and the imagination; for which cause Festus reckoned Paul mad, and the first Christians sought martyrdom. And if

Cler. Be shorter; we see you can preach.

Qua. If I do, 'tis truth without tythes, and can but half offend thee. Cler. Mighty witty! I just mentioned preaching, and presently tythes must be brought in for company.

Qua. Why, dost thou like them asunder?

Cler. Fiddle faddle, what has all this to do with enthusiasm ?

Qua. Nothing; and wherefore didst thou begin it? I have shown thee thy weak reasoning about enthusiasm: What sayest thou in answer?

Cler. That the Quakers are enthusiasts.

Qua. And givest no reason. Is it thus thou convincest gainsayers, and edifiest thy flock?

Cler. My flock won't come to you for edification.

Qua. It is well for thee that they do not. But to keep thee to the point, if I can; I tell thee, that we are no enthusiasts, and I will give thee a reason: We pretend to no more of the Spirit than influences our actions, and our actions are sober and rational. Hast thou found in me the speech and wild behaviour of an enthusiast?

Cler. You have no ill knack at prating.

Qua. Friend, my prating costeth no man any thing.
Cler. Though 'tis enriched with the Spirit.

Qua. I thank thee; thou givest a reason why it should cost nothing. The Spirit is not bought nor sold, nor are the works of the Spirit: wherefore he neither receives fees, nor claimeth dues. Simon Magus, who traded in conjuration and spells, was profanely for making a commodity of the Holy Ghost, and offered money for him, doubtless with a design to make more. Thou knowest his doom; and yet, friend, there are many Simon Magus's in the world; yea, worse than Simon Magus. There be many who raise great revenues out of the Spirit; yea, and have him not.

Cler. Who goes from the point now?

Qua. I do not. I feared thou wouldest think me too much in the point. We were speaking of the Spirit.

Cler. Which you think you have. How do you know it?

Qua. There is but one way. I feel him.

Cler. But how shall I be satisfied of that?

Qua. The same way; thou must first feel him too.

Cler. So say all the enthusiasts in the world.

Qua. Friend, are all who have the Spirit enthusiasts ?
Cler. No.

Qua. How dost thee distinguish ?

Cler. By their works.

Qua. Thou sayest well. Now by what work of ours do we appear to be enthusiasts? We are sober in society, sober in our families: we fear God, and have an awful reverence for his name and power, and for this we continually read the Scriptures which testify of him; insmuch that, for this our love to the Bible, some of thy brethren laugh us to scorn, and scoffingly say, that we are Bible-mad. We fast and we pray in private, and preach and pray in our religious assemblies, and we have universal charity. We open our purses cheerfully for the support of the public; we are dutiful subjects, and meddle not in factions; we maintain all our own poor, and contribute not the less to thine; and even the clergy have part of our substance. this true character the marks of enthusiasm ?

Cler. You indeed maintain a fair outside.
Qua. Canst thou see farther?

Cler. I can see your ghostly hummings and haw-ings.

Seest thou in

Qua. Is it not as easy for thee to call them sighs and groans, which cannot be uttered; whereof thou must have read, but seemest not to understand?

Cler. Why, who can understand the use of your silent meetings? Qua. We do, and thou mayest. Friend, our devotion and holy exercises are not taken out of a book, but begin first at the heart; and when the heart dictateth not, we speak not. Our godliness is not performed like a play, by rehearsal.

Cler. This is a villainous reflexion upon the Common-Prayer.

Qua. Thou makest it then. I am only defending the religious worship of the people called Quakers; and I have defended it. I do not revile thy church exercise: why revilest thou me ?

Cler. Who are they that perform their devotion by rebearsal, like a play?

Qua. We do not: and is it not lawful to say, we do not? Knowest thou any that do?

Cler. We have a form of prayers, the best that ever was composed, and find great devotion in it.

Qua. I rejoice in it; I like all devotion that is paid to God, and warranted by the Scriptures. I find no fault with thine; only it is not meet for me, who find more fervency in my own, and more edification. And what is the end of devotion but edification?

Cler. Yes, the glory of God.

Qua. God is not glorified, where men are not edified. Hence eve ry man must glorify God his own way.

Cler. What, in an erroneous way?

Qua. Those are words. No man errs who pleases God; who is, doubtless, pleased with our best endeavours to please him. Knowest thou any better rule ?

Cler. Yes, the rule of certainty.

Qua. This is certainty. Other certainty than this is not found amongst men, who must all answer for themselves; and therefore must all worship God, as each thinks best.

Cler. Which would introduce a thorough anarchy in worship.

Qua. So there is in faces; and what harm ensueth? God made faces different: canst thou make them uniform?

Cler. No; but minds are different from faces. They may be altered by reasoning.

Qua. Sometimes for the worse, as well as the better; and so may faces be altered by good or bad keeping. But thou mayest depend upon it, minds will always vary as infinitely as faces; and for ought I know, more, as their substance is more delicate and quick, and knoweth no particular figure and dimensions.

Cler. There is, however, no harm in reasoning with them.

Qua. I concur with thee, if that reasoning be free from deceit, the next worst thing to violence, which ought never to be employed about the mind, which it can never change.

Cler. But in case of obstinacy and disobedience, what remedy is there?

Qua. None. God only can judge the heart; which he only can see. Thou mayest think me obstinate: but I declare sincerely I am not; and thou in charity oughtest to believe me. If thou dost not, thou art not a good Christian; and if thou wouldest punish me, thou art no Christian. I do not think that thou art obstinate, and adherest to opinions which thou dislikest; and I would not hurt a hair of thy head, no, not though I thought thee obstinate.

Cler. This is plausibly said: but God keep me out of thy power. Qua. I desire not to have thee in my power: I know the frailty of human nature, and the deceitfulness of power, which perhaps I might abuse. Wherefore I would neither have thee in mine, nor be myself subject unto thine.

Cler. Ay, but you are only a private man.

Qua. Friend, all Christians, as Christians, are private men. There is neither high nor low in Christianity, but in the degrees of Christian perfections; and to found dominion in grace, is indeed fanaticism, as the clergy, in their disputes with the Presbyterians, have justly called it. Cler. Ay, but they meant civil power.

Qua. Knowest thou any power in society but civil power?
Cler. Yes, certainly, power ecclesiastical.

Qua. What to do?

Cler. To coerce and punish offenders against the laws of the church. Qua. What, in their bodies and property?

Cler. Without doubt.

Qua. And is not this manifest civil power ?

Cler. Yes, in its effect.

Qua. Then it is in effect, and in truth, and entirely civil power, which Christianity is a stranger unto; and which is an enemy to Christianity, when it meddleth therewith.

Cler. How, are we not all subject to the laws of the church?

Qua.'To the laws of Christ, if thou pleasest; my conscience knoweth no other master. Doth thine?

Cler. No. But my conscience tells me that there ought to be spiritual governors in the church.

Qua. Governors are masters; and the conscience cannot be mastered.

Cler. What, not directed?

Qua. If by direction thou meanest instruction, this hath no relation to government. And all men that can instruct, ought to instruct.