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A. (Laughingly,) I have the honor of being an alderman of the city of Elmira.

Q. What is your business?

A. My principal business is that of a bookkeeper for the honse of Stewart & Ufford, in Elmira.

Q. Where were you occupied in April, 1865?

A. At the same place.

Q. But not in the same store where you are now ?

A. No, sir. Our store was burned last winter. We were in Nos. 20 and 22 Lake street in April, 1865.

Q. Do you recollect of a gentleman coming into that store on the 13th or 14th of April with any peculiar dress?

A. I do.

Q. Give us a general idea of the dress.

A. The only portion of the dress that I noticed particularly was the coat. It was, as I remember it, a coat buttoned up with a full row of buttons in front and on the sides; with a belt fastening about the waist, and the skirt gathered into it below the waist.

Q. Do you remember the color?

A. It was some dark color, either quite a dark gray or a dark blue; I think more likely the former.

Q. Did you hear him in conversation with anybody?

A. I did

Q. About what length of time was he there, do you suppose?

A. I could not say. He was there probably ten minutes after I went in.

Q. With whom was he talking?

A. He was talking with our cutter, Mr. Carroll.

Q. Have you any means of fixing the date?

A. The only means I have of knowing the date is this fact, that it was the time when one of our house was in New York buying goods. I made an entry in the cash book showing when he took money to go to New York, and when he got back from New York and settled his account.

Q. State when he left.

A. The date of his leaving is the 12th of April, 1865.

Q. The date of his return?

A. The 15th of April, 1865.

Q. Have you ever seen that man since?

A. I think I have.

Q. Where did you see him?

A. I saw him in the jail, above here.

Q. Is that the same man? (Pointing to the prisoner, who had been requested

to stand up.)

A. I have no doubt but that is the same man.

Q. Did you have any conversation with him at the jail?

A. I did.

Q. Was there anything in the tone of his voice and manner which would enable you to recollect?

I do not remember the tone of

A. Yes, sir; more especially in the manner. his voice so much as the manner of the gentleman. I saw him and heard him talking. My attention was called particularly to him by his dress. I took particular notice of that, and it was his manner that impressed me with a recognition of him.

Cross-examined by Mr. PIERREPONT :

Q. Wont you open your book again and tell the jury what that book is?
A. It is a petit cash book.

Q. Do you enter in that book all the cash that is received and paid out?

A. No, sir.

Q. What do you enter?

A. We only enter the cash accounts on our ledger such as merchandise, expenses, &c., and the individual accounts of members of the firm, and of the clerks, and of money loaned or borrowed, if such should ever be the case.

Q. Look at that book and read the entry there that relates to the business of one of the house.

A. The date is "April 12th," under the heading of “Loan account."

"D.

E. Ufford, New York, $105." On the 15th, his charges, "D. E. Ufford, expense, &c., in New York, $95 62."

Q. From that you know when he left and when he got back?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. When did he leave?

A. He left on the evening train of the 12th.

Q. When did he get back?

A. He got back on the morning of the 15th.

Q. When was it you saw the man with the peculiar dress in your place?

A. I could not state. It was either the 13th or 14th.

Q. Which?

A. I could not say.

Q. Did he buy anything?

A. I do not know that he did?

Q. Do you know whether he did or not?

A. I do not.

Q. If you sold him anything it would be entered, would it not?

A. No, sir; the amount of the sale would be entered, but not the individual

Q. It would be entered on something, would it not?

A. It would be entered on a ticket, and then figured up on the cash account. Q. It would go into the cash account, would it not?

A. Yes, sir.

(Mr. BRADLEY. There would be nothing to show who made the purchase? A. No, sir.)

Q. The amount would be known and appear on the cash book?

A. Not the amount. In our business the amount of each sale is put on a ticket and that ticket placed upon a spindle. The aggregate of the tickets is footed at night, and that aggregate entered on the cash books.

Q. If one of you sold a coat on a particular day you would have something that would go to show who sold it?

A. We should if it was a coat to be made, and a measure to be taken; otherwise not.

Q. It would be either entered as a cash sale, or entered somewhere on your books?

A. No, sir.

Q. Could any person in your house sell a coat and put the money in his pocket?

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A. I could not say it was the custom to sell coats and put the money in the pocket. As I said before, the custom was, when a person made a sale, to put the amount on a ticket, and place that ticket on a spindle. As I said before, the aggregate of the amount on the spindle was footed up, and entered on the cash book as a sale.

Q. What was done with the papers on the spindle?

A. They were destroyed-that is, thrown into the waste-basket and burned

Q. And that is the way in which the entries would go upon the cash book A. Yes, sir.

Q. When did you next see this man after that day—the 12th, 13th, or 14th, or whenever it was?

A. I think I saw him in this room.

Q. How long ago?

A. I should judge three weeks ago.

Q. Is his beard in the same condition now that it was three weeks ago?
A. I should judge it was, or nearly so.

Q. Is it in the same condition now as it was when you saw him in Elmira?

A. His beard is of a different shape now from what I remember of its being then.

Q. Tell the jury how it was when you saw it at Elmira.

A. My impression is that the goatee was not as long then as it is now,

covered rather more of the surface of the chin.

and

Q. You are sure there was a goatee covering the surface of the chin at that time?

A. I am.

Q. Were there side whiskers then?

A. I do not remember any side whiskers.

Q. Was there any moustache then?

A. If any, but a slight one. I think there was a slight moustache.

Q. The difference between the goatee now and then is, that then it covered more space?

(Mr. BRADLEY. And was not so long?

A. Yes, sir.)

Q. Do you think it was of a lighter or a darker color than now, or of the same color?

A. It was very near the same color.

Q. There is no more difference than the ordinary dressing of it would make ? A. Probably not. I did not recognize any material difference in the color. Q. But what day of the month you are not willing to state?

A. No, sir; I could not say whether the 13th or 14th.

Q. Had you ever seen him before that time?

A. Not that I know of.

Q. Will you tell us at what hour of the day you saw him there?

A. It was after I came in from my lunch.

Q. What time of day?

A. I generally, and did at that time, have my lunch at haif-past 12. It was somewhere after that. It might have been 2 o'clock.

Q Do you think it was?

A. I could not say positively. I went to my lunch at half-past 12, and my memory is, that when I returned from my lunch I saw this man there.

By Mr. BRADLEY:

Q. I understand you to say that you have no doubt about this being the same man?

A. No, sir.

JOSEPH CARROLL sworn and examined.

By Mr. BRADLEY:

Q. Where do you reside?

A. In Elmira, New York.

Q. Where did you reside in April, 1865?

A. In Elmira, New York.

Q. What was your occupation at that time?

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Q. Do you recollect any gentleman coming into the store about the time of the assassination of the President dressed in any peculiar manner?

A. I do.

Q. Who attended to the man in the store?

A. I did.

Q. Describe his dress.

A. He wore a coat with a shoulder-piece on, pleated in front and behind, of mixed goods.

Q. When you say "mixed goods" do you mean gray?

A. I do not mean gray exactly. I mean a sort of brownish color. There were a variety of colors in it.

Q. Anything else peculiar about the dress, except the pleats, &c.?

A. It was a dress that was not usually worn.

Q. Did you ever see one like it?

A. Not exactly like it.

Q. Did you ever see any of the Canadian costumes, as they are called?
A. I thought the gentlemen was a Canadian at first.

Q. How was the coat fastened?

A. At the neck, and at the waist with a belt.

Q. State whether you had any conversation with that man.

A. I did.

Q How long did it continue, do you suppose?

.A. It might have lasted twenty minutes or thereabouts.

Q. State whether or not he came there for the purpose of getting clothes? A. He came there for the purpose of getting clothes; at least he spoke so. Q. Do you remember whether he was measured for any clothes?

A. No, sir.

Q. Why not?

A. We did not have the goods he inquired for.

Q. Can you state whether you were in expectation of those goods, and said anything on the subject of expecting them?

(Objected to by Mr. PIERREPONT. Objection sustained.)

Q. State if you can find the date with any degree of certainty.

A. The first time was the 13th. He came in on the 14th also.

Q. He came in twice?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. How do you fix it was those two days?

A. By our petit cash-book.

Q. What fact is there in the cash-book that enables you to fix the date?

A. Mr. Ufford, the proprietor of the house, went to New York on the night of the 12th.

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Q. Did you have any conversation with him?
A. Some.

The prisoner was here requested to stand up.]
Q. Is that the man? (pointing to the prisoner.
A. That is the man.

Cross-examined by Mr. PIERREPONT:

Q. How long have you lived in this country, or have you always lived here? A. I have lived here for some twenty-eight years.

Q. What country did you come from?

A. St. John's, Newfoundland.

Q. To what place did you go when you first came to this country?

A. Boston, Massachusetts.

Q. How long did you stay there?

A. I staid there up to thirteen years ago.

Q Then where did you go?

A. To Elmira, New York.

Q. Have you been there ever since?

A. I have.

Q. How long have you been cutter in this tailorshop?

A. Thirteen years the 5th of last March.

Q. Did you sell this man that came that day anything?

A. No, sir.

Q. Did you think he was a tailor, or did you tell anybody you thought so? A. No, sir.

Q. Did you have a conversation with any one in which you told them the man you saw there you thought was a tailor?

A. No, sir.

Q. Do you know an officer in your place named Knapp?

A. I do.

Q. Did you talk with him about it?

A. He came into the store one day and I think we spoke something on the subject. I know we did.

Q. Do you remember what you told Knapp?

A. He spoke to me something about it, and said that if I was going to Washington he would like to go when I did, and asked me if I knew anything about the matter. I remember speaking something about him. I do not distinctly remember the amount of words we used at that time.

Q. At any time do you remember telling him anything about thinking that he was a tailor?

A. I never did. I never thought he was a tailor.

Q. Did you give any reason why you talked with him?

A. I spoke to him about his dress. It was a sort of dress that was rather peculiar.

Q. You told Mr. Knapp so?

A. I do not remember whether I did or did not.

Q. Do you know Major Field of your place, who keeps a hotel?

A. I do.

Q. Have you talked with him about it, any?

A. I think a very little.

Q. Did you tell him on what day you saw this man there?

A. I fix my dates from the time Mr. Ufford went to New York and returned.

Q. Did you tell Major Field on what day you saw him there?

A. I do not remember. I think I did not.

Q. Did you tell Mr. Knapp on what day you saw him there?
A. I do not distinctly remember.

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